Michigan Posted October 5, 2005 Report Share Posted October 5, 2005 PCGS is considering a new MS 1-100 grading system to replace the MS1-70 scale currently being used. Reaction IMO seems to be 90/10 against this idea from comments I have read around the internet. What do you think? The idea will be officially presented at a meeting of registry set participants at the FUN show in Florida this January. Some people say it is a done deal, I'm not sure of that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
izzy452 Posted October 5, 2005 Report Share Posted October 5, 2005 I think the idea stinks, all it would do is create confussion in the grading system. For instance, If I had a MS69 coin in a system of 1 to 70 where would it fit in a system of 1 to 100 . Would PCGS regrade all their coin for free ? I think not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LostDutchman Posted October 5, 2005 Report Share Posted October 5, 2005 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jtryka Posted October 5, 2005 Report Share Posted October 5, 2005 1-70 is already too much, and look at how many potential grades are not even being used, like EF-46 through EF-49, or AU-57 etc. There is no need for a 100 point scale unless you also grade comics and baseball cards on a 100 point scale and want to improve margins by letting your graders swing between the products you grade (which given that this is PCGS seems plausable at least). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UncleBobo Posted October 5, 2005 Report Share Posted October 5, 2005 Absolutely pointless. The only reason for them to do this would be for the free press they would get. Maybe they want to force people to resubmit their graded coins to be judged on their new system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobbycoin Posted October 5, 2005 Report Share Posted October 5, 2005 Me thinks they would need to put some sort of indication that it is the new system so that there would not be confusion of "perfect" (old) or 70/100 (new). -Bobby Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlueke Posted October 5, 2005 Report Share Posted October 5, 2005 Would PCGS regrade all their coin for free ? Probably the most important question. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 50cents Posted October 5, 2005 Report Share Posted October 5, 2005 A way for them to make more $$$$$$$$$$ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackhawk Posted October 5, 2005 Report Share Posted October 5, 2005 A way for them to make more $$$$$$$$$$ Absolutely. Imagine all those millions of coins that people would send in for re-grading under the new system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brett Posted October 5, 2005 Report Share Posted October 5, 2005 Not to mention also if PCGS did this, not soon after every other 3rd party grading service would do this. It would make people who have slabbed coins, resubmit every one back to the 3rd party companies. Can you say millions and millions of profit for them. And I would have to agree with Izzy, where would a current MS-69 or any other grade be regraded at. And I also that there are too many numbers in the 1-70 scale not even being used. Not to mention that everyone would have to learn a new grading system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlueke Posted October 5, 2005 Report Share Posted October 5, 2005 It would be different if it was necessary, but as has been pointed out they don't even use all 70 points now. Then there's the whole subjectivity of grading bit which would only get worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burks Posted October 5, 2005 Report Share Posted October 5, 2005 I think it is pretty stupid. The 70 point scale is already pretty well established in the coin community. No reason to change something that already works. To me it is something to make registry set owners happy. There is more room for them to claim they have the best set because the next guy has a MS-99 instead of a MS-100. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jtryka Posted October 5, 2005 Report Share Posted October 5, 2005 The only reason this is being considered is the registry hounds looking for the extra edge. Right now, a coin grading MS-69.5 will get bumped to MS-70, under the new system it will only be an MS-99 instead of an MS-100. For the rest of us that care more about the coins than the rankings it's just a whole lot of nonsense. Unfortunately it has the potential to spread the disease affecting registry nuts to those not currently affected. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gpnyc Posted October 5, 2005 Report Share Posted October 5, 2005 PGCS will be sorely disappointed if they think the rest of the coin community will follow their lead. In fact, they are the "leader" in their own eyes only. This is the product of arrogance yet is also typical of the way PCGS has always done business. They need to be taken down a notch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jtryka Posted October 5, 2005 Report Share Posted October 5, 2005 PGCS will be sorely disappointed if they think the rest of the coin community will follow their lead. In fact, they are the "leader" in their own eyes only. This is the product of arrogance yet is also typical of the way PCGS has always done business. They need to be taken down a notch. Here here! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Stujoe Posted October 5, 2005 Report Share Posted October 5, 2005 I really enjoy seeing the lather it has worked up in the CU forums. It has been rather entertaining. The sky really is seen to be totally falling over there. I think the effect on numismatics and my collecting life in particular would be negligible. Even if PCGS can get the major price guides like the Redbook and Coin Values/Trends and Greysheet and everyone else to go along with it, there will be some kind of fairly easy grade conversion that will be able to be applied to 99% of the coins I collect so that I can price them properly. The people it will hurt is those that feel the need to get their coins in new PCGS holders either for the registry or to maintain liquidity and have to re-fill PCGS's cofffers to do it. Neither scenario applies to me. Nor do I think it applies to the majority of the hobby. It does apply to about 90% of the posters at the PCGS forums though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan769 Posted October 5, 2005 Report Share Posted October 5, 2005 Like you said Stu, they are higher end coin collectors with registry sets. No way they want that, and neither would I, tho it wouldn't affect me much either. I got the email inviting me to the PCGS luncheon/talk about this. I am planning on going to the FUN show, but I don't think I want to spend 2 hours listening to them trying to sway me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AuldFartte Posted October 5, 2005 Report Share Posted October 5, 2005 The 100 point proposal is absolutely the stupidest thing I've heard in the past few weeks I wish the entire industry would go back to G, VG, F, VF, EF, UNC and BU. But then, I'm an old guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
28Plain Posted October 6, 2005 Report Share Posted October 6, 2005 Maybe PCGS will destroy themselves with this new brainfart. They're a company based on hucksterism anyway. I don't take their grades seriously now and probably wouldn't revise my opinion of their graders even with a new point scale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grifter Posted October 6, 2005 Report Share Posted October 6, 2005 Very crappy idea. Just one more way to get more money. But, how do you think coins in slabs now will be regarded say 25 years down the road, if there is a new system. Old ones may become another part of coin collecting. Idk, maybe it's just me... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Stujoe Posted October 6, 2005 Report Share Posted October 6, 2005 1-70 is already too much, and look at how many potential grades are not even being used, like EF-46 through EF-49, or AU-57 etc. The problem is that they don't care about hardly any of the first 59 grades. As you say, they don't use all those grades anyway so there is no reason to change them. I think the real goal is to expand the 11 MS grades. That is where the 'money' is. To me, decimal grading makes more sense if they want to go and expand the scale. It gives them an infinite scale between 60 and 70 to differentiate in without screwing anything else up. There are 2 problems with that. The first is psychological. They might be able to persuade people into thinking they can grade MS coins to 20 or 30 distinct levels by using MS78, MS82, etc. It would be a tougher sell if they tried to use 64.66 and 65.25. People would tend to think the latter is ridiculous. No one can grade to a fraction. The other problem is that there would be no pressing need to get your coins re-holdered. An MS65 would still be at least an MS65. It might be an MS65.25 or an MS65.66 but at worst it will still be MS65. It is the same scale. Not true if your MS65 now needs to be reholdered to an MS82 or MS83 on a whole new scale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GDJMSP Posted October 6, 2005 Report Share Posted October 6, 2005 Of course the whole reason could be because many have gotten wiser when it comes to grading coins and business is being hurt by the competition. They may see this simply as way counter that to some degree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlueke Posted October 6, 2005 Report Share Posted October 6, 2005 Of course the whole reason could be because many have gotten wiser when it comes to grading coins and business is being hurt by the competition. They may see this simply as way counter that to some degree. I think it would also be quite risky. It might be an opening for NGC and ANACS to get market share from people who don't want to put up with regrding all their coins. I think Stujoe makes a great point with the decimal system between MS60 and MSD70. That would serve a perceived need for more grades while not really impacting prices for existing coins. Of course PCGS may want to try and shift prices and thus the decimal point option doesn't suit their goal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henare Posted October 6, 2005 Report Share Posted October 6, 2005 let's make this easy: is there anyone out there who thinks this is a good idea? (other than pcgs, of course ... ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gxseries Posted October 6, 2005 Report Share Posted October 6, 2005 This is completely retarded. IF, such coin grading companies weren't so well established right now, then you might argue that using a base 100 might be a nice number to play with. Honestly, when I first tried to understand what the grading system meant, I couldn't understand why the figure 70 is used, instead of 100. It might be good for people who comes new into the numisatic field, but for people who got used to it - oh no. I am sensing a horrible scheme behind this, which is going to be a software type. The base 100 could be used as a percentage format, and who knows if this can happen... Let's say you send your coin in, they would just scan your coin and compare it against their so called perfect defination of NEWMS100 scale and calculate the area of imperfectness against theirs... remember that they are grading in terms of tens of thousands per month and they do have the funds, so they might need some type of method to speed up the whole process... but again, some random speculations on my part... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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