netFish Posted February 25, 2010 Report Share Posted February 25, 2010 i have opinion/rhetorical question: does it make sense to collect Novodel's coins ? I curious if it worth my time or not .... help to decide Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STEVE MOULDING Posted February 25, 2010 Report Share Posted February 25, 2010 i have opinion/rhetorical question: does it make sense to collect Novodel's coins ? I curious if it worth my time or not .... help to decide Your question, as put, makes little sense to me. If you're asking as a collector, then why do you need to be advised on what to collect? If you like them collect them! What does it mean 'worth my time' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gxseries Posted February 25, 2010 Report Share Posted February 25, 2010 Be warned though: don't be fooled by sellers who claim coins as novodels. Novodels are supposed to be official "restrikes" by the mint, not some crazy fantasy or counterfeit coins. Novodels are very collectible but make sure that they are authentic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IgorS Posted February 25, 2010 Report Share Posted February 25, 2010 Novodel's production of the Imperial period coins by the Mint at St. Petersburg stopped in the last quarter of the 19th century. Keep that in mind when you say Novodel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aleksandr45 Posted February 25, 2010 Report Share Posted February 25, 2010 It very much a question at issue. For example. Rouble 1915. It is a lot of novodels, but them not to distinguish from the original. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maya Posted February 25, 2010 Report Share Posted February 25, 2010 I think there is a basic misunderstanding here as to the meaning of "Novodel". gxseries and IgorS touch on it briefly but I think that someone, more qualified that I, should give a concise explanation of what is meant by Novodel. I think too many people, as gxseries said, confuse them with fantasy pieces and counterfeits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexbq2 Posted February 25, 2010 Report Share Posted February 25, 2010 I think there is a basic misunderstanding here as to the meaning of "Novodel". gxseries and IgorS touch on it briefly but I think that someone, more qualified that I, should give a concise explanation of what is meant by Novodel.I think too many people, as gxseries said, confuse them with fantasy pieces and counterfeits. As I recall, Uzdenikov gave a brief definition of a Novodel as “An object struck at some date later than that indicated on the object, at the mint with original or newly cut dies, or outside of the mint but with original dies.” The reason for the last part of the definition is due to the fact that some Gangut roubles were struck at GIM with original dies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
one-kuna Posted February 26, 2010 Report Share Posted February 26, 2010 i have opinion/rhetorical question: does it make sense to collect Novodel's coins ? I curious if it worth my time or not .... help to decide if netFish can read russian,- one of the best article on this subjest is: I Spassky "on the NOVODEL coins" in a book "Proshloe nashei rodiny v pamyatnikax numizmatiki" pp105-125, well ill. Engilsh summary on page 214-215: Novodels are copies of old Russain coins which were manufactured by mints for over 200 years. The majority of them come from the St.Petersburg mint (XVIII-XIX c) and the Ekaterinburg mint (XIX c). It is also possible that Moscow mint took part in their manufacture during the XVIII c. The manufacture of novodels arose from the legalized practice of making medals to order. In St. Petersburg, this was common immediately after the mint started work again in 1738. In the same way as the cracked medal dies were replaced by new ones, a small number of coin dies were recopied and kept in store in anticipation of fresh orders. In time this led to the appearance of various "hybrids": the more fanciful among them were manufactured illegally by workmen in the mint, who had access to the dies. The novodels had some weak points as far as their technical aspects were concerned (dimensions, weight, metal, standard, edges).As a rule, edging instruments did not survive. It is possible to divide novodels into the following groups (not counting the "hybrid" combination): 1.late stamping with authentic dies 2.stamping with copies of dies 3.re-stamping with dies cut after previously issued coins, or even after their reproductions in books 4.copying of coins which were produced by mints other than the one involved 5.striking with "borrowed" dies 6.the manufacture of coins which did not exist before A great many die-copies of all types were destroyed in the St.Petersburg circa 1840, but since then there were two huge issues of novodels in Ekaterinburg, which included coins from other mints as well. Perhaps one of the first "invented" novodel is a denga of Peter the Great, bearing a Latin inscription and dating from 1700. The Manufacture of novodels coins was officially prohibited in the 1870s. Any questions, please ask one-kuna Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
netFish Posted February 26, 2010 Author Report Share Posted February 26, 2010 thank you to all, you answered my question. I liked "collect what you want". but all of you answered my question. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJB Posted February 26, 2010 Report Share Posted February 26, 2010 Be warned though: don't be fooled by sellers who claim coins as novodels. Novodels are supposed to be official "restrikes" by the mint, not some crazy fantasy or counterfeit coins. Novodels are very collectible but make sure that they are authentic. My other favorite is sellers who refer to fakes as 'Trial Strikes'. Novodels, Trial Strikes, when I see these listed, I think to myself 'Oh is that what they're calling these now?'. I wonder how many buyers fall into this trap? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
netFish Posted February 26, 2010 Author Report Share Posted February 26, 2010 i guess a lot, like those who is not expert, will fall into it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
one-kuna Posted February 26, 2010 Report Share Posted February 26, 2010 majority collectors in russia DO NOT collect novodels Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
netFish Posted February 26, 2010 Author Report Share Posted February 26, 2010 i will not do that as well Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
one-kuna Posted February 26, 2010 Report Share Posted February 26, 2010 i will not do that as well Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexbq2 Posted February 26, 2010 Report Share Posted February 26, 2010 majority collectors in russia DO NOT collect novodels That does not explain the high prices that Novodels habitually command. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
netFish Posted February 26, 2010 Author Report Share Posted February 26, 2010 so why NOVODELs has high prices ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexbq2 Posted February 26, 2010 Report Share Posted February 26, 2010 so why NOVODELs has high prices ? Because enough people are willing to pay the high prices. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IgorS Posted February 26, 2010 Report Share Posted February 26, 2010 Because enough people a willing to pay the high prices. And those Novodels do look good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
netFish Posted February 26, 2010 Author Report Share Posted February 26, 2010 i like coins even if they do not look to good, because you can feel history and age .... that's what i think ..... ... if coin 300-400 years old ..... it can not look to good, unless you will pay thousands so my answer about collecting Novodels - i am definitely not going to ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maya Posted February 26, 2010 Report Share Posted February 26, 2010 i like coins even if they do not look to good, because you can feel history and age .... that's what i think ..... ... if coin 300-400 years old ..... it can not look to good, unless you will pay thousands so my answer about collecting Novodels - i am definitely not going to ! Collecting coins is totally subjective. Every individual collector collects what appeals to him/her. There are absolutely no rules. There is absolutely nothing wrong with collecting novodels as long as you know what you are collecting. There is no hierarchy. Collecting novodels does not make you any less of a collector than someone who, for argument's sake, collects British Sovereigns or US Saint-Gaudens Double Eagles. It is strictly a personal choice dictated by personal taste. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
netFish Posted February 26, 2010 Author Report Share Posted February 26, 2010 i posted question here because i wanted to decide for myself do it or not. I made my choice. Maya, you are absolutely right - what to collect - strictly personal choice Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squirrel Posted February 27, 2010 Report Share Posted February 27, 2010 Collecting coins is totally subjective. Every individual collector collects what appeals to him/her. There are absolutely no rules. There is absolutely nothing wrong with collecting novodels as long as you know what you are collecting.There is no hierarchy. Collecting novodels does not make you any less of a collector than someone who, for argument's sake, collects British Sovereigns or US Saint-Gaudens Double Eagles. It is strictly a personal choice dictated by personal taste. Exactly to the point! Why do any of us collect these little pieces of round (not always) metal with pictures and words.... they can not keep the rain off of our heads or put food on the table (unless we choose to part with them)..... some folks collect beer cans, dead insects, etc. My dear mother collects the tiny green mossy plants that grow on tree bark, and talks endlessly about it! So I guess its whatever keeps you from being bored! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
altyn Posted February 28, 2010 Report Share Posted February 28, 2010 Exactly to the point! Why do any of us collect these little pieces of round (not always) metal with pictures and words.... they can not keep the rain off of our heads or put food on the table (unless we choose to part with them)..... some folks collect beer cans, dead insects, etc. My dear mother collects the tiny green mossy plants that grow on tree bark, and talks endlessly about it! So I guess its whatever keeps you from being bored! and some weirdos collect dead insects AND coins... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexbq2 Posted February 28, 2010 Report Share Posted February 28, 2010 and some weirdos collect dead insects AND coins... Nice bugs - Big! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grivna1726 Posted February 28, 2010 Report Share Posted February 28, 2010 and some weirdos collect dead insects AND coins... That's one huge bug. Good thing it's dead. Otherwise it might be deciding whether it should drag you off to the swamp, or eat you where you are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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