Ruble Posted January 12, 2008 Report Share Posted January 12, 2008 ebay item 150204990168 is it not a madness Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grivna1726 Posted January 12, 2008 Report Share Posted January 12, 2008 ebay item 150204990168 is it not a madness It's a lot of money compared to what these coins brought in the past, I suppose. But what on earth could possibly be more common than a high grade Morgan dollar and just look at what their prices are like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thee_Immortal_One Posted January 13, 2008 Report Share Posted January 13, 2008 I chose the offer route. I will let you know if it is taken. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basilio Posted January 13, 2008 Report Share Posted January 13, 2008 ebay item 150204990168 is it not a madness That is 100% madness.. 1912 - is too simple specimen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IlyaE Posted January 13, 2008 Report Share Posted January 13, 2008 It is the highest graded, but 4.5K is sure a lot of money for a relatively common rouble, considering that you can get MS-64 for $600, the seller must be pretty happy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruble Posted January 13, 2008 Author Report Share Posted January 13, 2008 Indeed 4.5k a surprise, who would expect such a high price for a coin which is quite common compare to other rubles. Don’t have much to say but to congratulate the seller. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rain386 Posted January 13, 2008 Report Share Posted January 13, 2008 suprising indeed I hoped to find extra large pictures and compare it to mine 1912 rouble. http://omnicoin.com/coin_view_enlarge.aspx?id=925171 These small scratches are on the holder plastic. I´ve wondered how the crown looks in MS-65 or at least 63. Does anyone have close pic from the crown? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldman Posted January 14, 2008 Report Share Posted January 14, 2008 It is the highest graded, but 4.5K is sure a lot of money for a relatively common rouble, considering that you can get MS-64 for $600, the seller must be pretty happy. BTW, it is not THE highest graded, actually. This is ONE of the highest graded. I strongly believe that the $4500 paid for the coin is a mad price. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheburgen Posted January 14, 2008 Report Share Posted January 14, 2008 Simple Rouble, not rare at all, the grade is high of course, but I would say the buyer is overpaid about 3500$. P.S. When I purchased 1859 RUSSIA 1 Rouble Nicholas I Memorial NGC PF63 in August 2006 for 5K it was crazy. Any offers right now guys? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldman Posted January 14, 2008 Report Share Posted January 14, 2008 Simple Rouble, not rare at all, the grade is high of course, but I would say the buyer is overpaid about 3500$. He can afford it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheburgen Posted January 14, 2008 Report Share Posted January 14, 2008 He can afford it I think you are right: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...em=310009828040 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...em=170179708284 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...em=250197140407 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...em=150188931138 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...em=320185997496 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...em=190172920921 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...em=320173578228 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...em=150177478723 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...em=160165818507 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marina Posted January 14, 2008 Report Share Posted January 14, 2008 suprising indeed I hoped to find extra large pictures and compare it to mine 1912 rouble. http://omnicoin.com/coin_view_enlarge.aspx?id=925171 These small scratches are on the holder plastic. I´ve wondered how the crown looks in MS-65 or at least 63. Does anyone have close pic from the crown? Goldberg Lot# 3456 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruble Posted January 14, 2008 Author Report Share Posted January 14, 2008 I think you are right: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...em=310009828040 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...em=170179708284 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...em=250197140407 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...em=150188931138 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...em=320185997496 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...em=190172920921 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...em=320173578228 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...em=150177478723 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...em=160165818507 Nice History Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJB Posted April 23, 2008 Report Share Posted April 23, 2008 Some of these prices are over the top. Especially when you compare the price in Krause's catalog to what some of the winning bids net. I know, I know the catalog is not absolute, but some of the money forked over for some of these pieces seems pretty insane. For example, I just picked up an 1883 coronation ruble from the Russian Empire recently for $50 dollars at a local coin store. It grades about an XF and has light toning. I saw this same coin sell for over $1,200, in slightly better condition on Ebay. It's amazing what some people are willing to spend for Russian coins and notes as of late. Must be nice to have that much money to spare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grivna1726 Posted April 23, 2008 Report Share Posted April 23, 2008 Some of these prices are over the top. Especially when you compare the price in Krause's catalog to what some of the winning bids net. I know, I know the catalog is not absolute, but some of the money forked over for some of these pieces seems pretty insane. For example, I just picked up an 1883 coronation ruble from the Russian Empire recently for $50 dollars at a local coin store. It grades about an XF and has light toning. I saw this same coin sell for over $1,200, in slightly better condition on Ebay. It's amazing what some people are willing to spend for Russian coins and notes as of late. Must be nice to have that much money to spare. Price rises have been remarkable, but here are a few things to consider: 1) Russians have a long history of interest in numismatics as shown by important works published in Imperial times such as the Grand Duke's Corpus. Coins are in their blood. 2) Russian coin prices were artificially low during the Soviet period because speculation in Imperial coins was discouraged and, at times, considered dangerously politically suspect. With the home country effectively removed from the international coin market for about 75 years, Russian coin prices were extremely low in comparison to coins of other European countries of similar rarity and importance. 3) Russians are more affluent than they were during Soviet times and they are now able to legally buy coins from outside the boundaries of the former Soviet Union. This has resulted in them buying up their national heritage from outside Russia. As a result, long suppressed market forces are making up for lost time. No more coins with a population that you can count on your fingers will be sold for a few hundred dollars. In this respect, collectors in the West might be shellshocked by changes to the price structure as we knew it, but we were living in a fool's paradise and reality is reasserting itself. 4) Despite the price changes, Russian coin prices remain well below US coin prices for coins of similar rarity. I think that gap will likely continue to narrow in coming years due to relative changes in affluence between the 2 countries. So, are prices really so "crazy"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marv Posted April 27, 2008 Report Share Posted April 27, 2008 I think what is happening is a reflection of the booming Russian economy, at least for some people. The same coin price explosion is happening with the other booming economies of China and India. Nice Chinese republican dollars are going out of sight right now. As an example, I'm told by one of the most knowledgeable American dealers in Chinese coins, that the pavillion dollar I bought from him in 1984 for $750, which I considered extremely high at the time, would now garner somewhere north of $10,000! The coin is without peer as far as I know, at least a 66 maybe 67. The point is, that if you have the money, you're going to go after the best quality you can find. When a lot of people have the money, and the items they are seeking are rare, prices can go sky high. And by 'rare', I include condition rarity. In my case, there are quite a few pavillion dollars that are not mint state, or, if they are, they're hairlined, bag marked etc., just as with so many Morgan dollars. For example, an 1878S Morgan is valued by PCGS at $285 in MS65, $930 in MS66 but jumps to $10,300 in MS67! I presume someone has actually paid that much for it to appear in the price guide. To find any Morgan dollar in MS67 is rather a miracle given how they were stored, and the price reflects that. With diamonds, the same holds true. A flawless diamond is worth far more, all other things being equal, than a diamond with flaws. And so it goes. With respect to the 1912 rouble in MS65 that sold for $4500, I don't know if the person who bought it for that amount made a wise choice; only that person can know. It may simply be that, to him/her, $4500 is not a great deal of money. There are people like that - people who will pay $2000 a night for a hotel accommodation! They have a much different perspective than most of the rest of us mortals. On the other side of the coin, people who bought high quality years ago and haven't sold yet feel good; people who sold a few years ago probably don't feel good; and people who waited to buy and desire high quality Russian coins definitely don't feel good about these prices. By the way, if you're curious, my avatar is a coin I bought in 2004 and haven't sold. My dealer, who was with me at the auction advised me NOT to pay $7500 for it, an NGC MS67, but it was too beautiful to resist, and I did. He said that was WAY too much. Anybody have a guess what the finest known (I believe) 1826 Wings Down rouble might bring at an auction today?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruble Posted April 27, 2008 Author Report Share Posted April 27, 2008 I think what is happening is a reflection of the booming Russian economy, at least for some people. The same coin price explosion is happening with the other booming economies of China and India. Nice Chinese republican dollars are going out of sight right now. As an example, I'm told by one of the most knowledgeable American dealers in Chinese coins, that the pavillion dollar I bought from him in 1984 for $750, which I considered extremely high at the time, would now garner somewhere north of $10,000! The coin is without peer as far as I know, at least a 66 maybe 67. The point is, that if you have the money, you're going to go after the best quality you can find. When a lot of people have the money, and the items they are seeking are rare, prices can go sky high. And by 'rare', I include condition rarity. In my case, there are quite a few pavillion dollars that are not mint state, or, if they are, they're hairlined, bag marked etc., just as with so many Morgan dollars. For example, an 1878S Morgan is valued by PCGS at $285 in MS65, $930 in MS66 but jumps to $10,300 in MS67! I presume someone has actually paid that much for it to appear in the price guide. To find any Morgan dollar in MS67 is rather a miracle given how they were stored, and the price reflects that. With diamonds, the same holds true. A flawless diamond is worth far more, all other things being equal, than a diamond with flaws. And so it goes. With respect to the 1912 rouble in MS65 that sold for $4500, I don't know if the person who bought it for that amount made a wise choice; only that person can know. It may simply be that, to him/her, $4500 is not a great deal of money. There are people like that - people who will pay $2000 a night for a hotel accommodation! They have a much different perspective than most of the rest of us mortals. On the other side of the coin, people who bought high quality years ago and haven't sold yet feel good; people who sold a few years ago probably don't feel good; and people who waited to buy and desire high quality Russian coins definitely don't feel good about these prices. By the way, if you're curious, my avatar is a coin I bought in 2004 and haven't sold. My dealer, who was with me at the auction advised me NOT to pay $7500 for it, an NGC MS67, but it was too beautiful to resist, and I did. He said that was WAY too much. Anybody have a guess what the finest known (I believe) 1826 Wings Down rouble might bring at an auction today?? In case of rare coins yes I can understand, but lately people paying hips of money on practicaly common years or bullion coins. May you you right people throwing their money. May its just me personaly cannot comprehend it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobh Posted April 27, 2008 Report Share Posted April 27, 2008 Anybody have a guess what the finest known (I believe) 1826 Wings Down rouble might bring at an auction today?? If yours is the finest known, then nobody will know until you sell it, I guess! However, you might look at the next lower couple of grades and see what they brought, then try to figure out some kind of progression (e.g., each grade doubles in value). And that should give you an idea of the MINIMUM value for the highest grade; there are always people who pay much more to have the "finest known", so it will probably go for more. Congratulations on having the foresight (and the courage!) to buy it ... it is certainly something to be proud of! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gxseries Posted April 27, 2008 Report Share Posted April 27, 2008 Just to rub it in, probably like 4 years ago, I remember seeing a 1830 PF63 5 ruble gold coin for about 5000USD or something. Imagine the price of that today Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grivna1726 Posted April 27, 2008 Report Share Posted April 27, 2008 By the way, if you're curious, my avatar is a coin I bought in 2004 and haven't sold. My dealer, who was with me at the auction advised me NOT to pay $7500 for it, an NGC MS67, but it was too beautiful to resist, and I did. He said that was WAY too much. Anybody have a guess what the finest known (I believe) 1826 Wings Down rouble might bring at an auction today?? Beautiful coin. I have no idea what it would bring, except that it's a safe bet that it would be substantially more than you paid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gxseries Posted April 27, 2008 Report Share Posted April 27, 2008 Slightly unrelated but there are people like them: http://money.ninemsn.com.au/article.aspx?id=450664 Can't really compete against billionaires Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marv Posted April 27, 2008 Report Share Posted April 27, 2008 In case of rare coins yes I can understand, but lately people paying hips of money on practicaly common years or bullion coins. May you you right people throwing their money. May its just me personaly cannot comprehend it Most people cannot comprehend what it must be like to be able to spend $100,000 or more on a coin (or stamp). I know that when I bought my first house for $52,000, I had buyer's remorse big time, but stuck it out. That was 1975, and $52,000 seemed, to me at least, like an enormous amount of money. Nowadays, people buy houses everyday (I know it's slowed) for over $1,000,000, at least here in California. I have. When prices change rapidly, such as gas prices, those of us who have spent much of our lives under a different price structure have difficulties adapting. When I was a kid in the 1950's, gas was 29 cents a gallon. When the price (in the US) got to $1.00, I could hardly believe it. I thought, that's impossible to sustain. Now, here in California, regular is about $4.00 a gallon, and people would be overjoyed to have it be $1.00 again. So the market for high-end imperial Russian coins right now is apparently being driven by rich people, and we who are not rich will have to either be sellers, or be content with lower grade coins, just as has happened in the US market. It achieves nothing to dwell on whether this or that coin is overvalued. A coin's value is what someone will pay for it, nothing more. Perhaps in the future, the cycle will come full circle and coins will decline in value, but probably never get to what they cost in 1980. These coins will never increase in numbers (barring the discovery of huge hoards), but the population seeking them undoubtedly will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grivna1726 Posted April 27, 2008 Report Share Posted April 27, 2008 So the market for high-end imperial Russian coins right now is apparently being driven by rich people, and we who are not rich will have to either be sellers, or be content with lower grade coins, just as has happened in the US market. It achieves nothing to dwell on whether this or that coin is overvalued. A coin's value is what someone will pay for it, nothing more. Well said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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