p911 Posted May 16, 2007 Report Share Posted May 16, 2007 http://molotok.ru/catalog/lot/14412347 looks like a fake or not Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grivna1726 Posted May 16, 2007 Report Share Posted May 16, 2007 http://molotok.ru/catalog/lot/14412347looks like a fake or not The photos look very similar to this ebay sale. I recommend you stay away from both sales. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RW Julian Posted May 16, 2007 Report Share Posted May 16, 2007 The photos look very similar to this ebay sale. I recommend you stay away from both sales. Same photos, even down to the time stamp: 4 21:04. RWJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squirrel Posted May 16, 2007 Report Share Posted May 16, 2007 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
p911 Posted May 16, 2007 Author Report Share Posted May 16, 2007 thanks everybody Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BKB Posted May 16, 2007 Report Share Posted May 16, 2007 I know the ebay seller very well. He does not normally sell fakes. I wonder what is going on. I will ask him about the coin. Could somebody be selling a photo from ebay on molotok? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grivna1726 Posted May 16, 2007 Report Share Posted May 16, 2007 Could somebody be selling a photo from ebay on molotok? That is certainly possible, maybe even probable in this case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squirrel Posted May 16, 2007 Report Share Posted May 16, 2007 On second look at the ebay listing above, the photos are better resolution. Looks polished and harshly cleaned, which gives it a fake look, but it could be original. Ive had good luck with that seller from ebay. Sadly, i have no experience with molotok.ru, other than the equivelant of a child with his nose pressed up to the window of a toy store. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheburgen Posted May 16, 2007 Report Share Posted May 16, 2007 I do not think that Dubovska (Alex) is selling the picture. Very well known dealer and reputation should be in the first place, no matter what. Moreover, I beleive that the seller from Molotok just stole the picture from Ebay and selling it (check the rating of the seller from Molotok, it's zero). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RW Julian Posted May 16, 2007 Report Share Posted May 16, 2007 On second look at the ebay listing above, the photos are better resolution.Looks polished and harshly cleaned, which gives it a fake look, but it could be original. Ive had good luck with that seller from ebay. Sadly, i have no experience with molotok.ru, other than the equivelant of a child with his nose pressed up to the window of a toy store. The coin also appeared on eBay at an earlier date. Here the seller was in Russia but said the coin was in Warsaw. It is interesting to note that the present seller on eBay uses one of the photos (of the edge) from the earlier sale but not the others. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...em=320087338471 RWJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheburgen Posted May 16, 2007 Report Share Posted May 16, 2007 The pictures of the edges are the same in both sales. I beleive that the coin is the same (check the sctratches in the middle of the eagle in both sales) but the present seller used a new pictures. It's kind of strange that the coin was sold to this buyer 4903alexanderz from Latvia (feedback is received) and now dubovska is selling it. Perhaps dubovska purchased it from 4903alexanderz and now just selling it. The seller from Molotok is a FRAUD. Stay away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gxseries Posted May 16, 2007 Report Share Posted May 16, 2007 Molotok is pretty notorious for picture selling. There are a few times when I saw the SAME pictures on molotok at the same time Not too sure if molotok does anything about it though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldman Posted May 16, 2007 Report Share Posted May 16, 2007 The coin seems to be genuine but in a low grade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maya Posted May 16, 2007 Report Share Posted May 16, 2007 It appears that Molotok took the coin off the market. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BKB Posted May 17, 2007 Report Share Posted May 17, 2007 I spoke to the eBay seller. He says that the coin is a consigned item. Says that the owner decided to list it on molotok.ru in violation of their agreement. Now he took it off molotok. As to the coin being original -- owner claims that it is. The coin will be in the US this week, then I will ask for eBay seller's personal opinion. I have no doubt that if it turns out to be a fake he will take it off eBay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheburgen Posted May 17, 2007 Report Share Posted May 17, 2007 <if it turns out to be a fake he will take it off eBay. The coin is already sold. Now here is the thing. If you are listing the same coin in 2 different places and in case the coin will be sold in 2 places at the same time, what you gonna do? Here is another thing in the lot description: Item location: philadelphia, pa, United States, The coin will be in the US this week? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grivna1726 Posted May 17, 2007 Report Share Posted May 17, 2007 <if it turns out to be a fake he will take it off eBay. The coin is already sold. Now here is the thing. If you are listing the same coin in 2 different places and in case the coin will be sold in 2 places at the same time, what you gonna do? Here is another thing in the lot description: Item location: philadelphia, pa, United States, The coin will be in the US this week? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BKB Posted May 17, 2007 Report Share Posted May 17, 2007 <if it turns out to be a fake he will take it off eBay. The coin is already sold. Now here is the thing. If you are listing the same coin in 2 different places and in case the coin will be sold in 2 places at the same time, what you gonna do? Here is another thing in the lot description: Item location: philadelphia, pa, United States, The coin will be in the US this week? I can only provide the info that I was given. There is a 100% guarantee of authenticity that was honored in the past from what I hear. As to the item location, I supose the shipping would be from Philadelphia. No reason writing that the item is located in Russia when it is on its way to the US. There was a gentlemens' agreement, from what I understand, that the item is original and that the ebay seller would be the exclusive lister. Sadly, not too many people in Russia, including Law professors, understand the concept of contract. I do not think that there is something evil that is going on here, although, the coin itself does not look authentic to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheburgen Posted May 17, 2007 Report Share Posted May 17, 2007 I can only provide the info that I was given. There is a 100% guarantee of authenticity that was honored in the past from what I hear. As to the item location, I supose the shipping would be from Philadelphia. No reason writing that the item is located in Russia when it is on its way to the US. There was a gentlemens' agreement, from what I understand, that the item is original and that the ebay seller would be the exclusive lister. Sadly, not too many people in Russia, including Law professors, understand the concept of contract. I do not think that there is something evil that is going on here, although, the coin itself does not look authentic to me. The funny thing about the Law. To my understanding the coin was in Russia, now it's on its way to the US. So, if the coin is 100% original, like the seller is stating, the friend of the seller is breaking the Law. If the coin is not original and it's the only legal way to send the coin from Russia to US, he is selling the fake stating that this is 100% original. Do you see any irony here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WCO Posted May 17, 2007 Report Share Posted May 17, 2007 The funny thing about the Law. To my understanding the coin was in Russia, now it's on its way to the US. So, if the coin is 100% original, like the seller is stating, the friend of the seller is breaking the Law. If the coin is not original and it's the only legal way to send the coin from Russia to US, he is selling the fake stating that this is 100% original. Do you see any irony here? I do see irony here. Ironically the coin was never in Russia. WCO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RW Julian Posted May 17, 2007 Report Share Posted May 17, 2007 I do see irony here. Ironically the coin was never in Russia. WCO It was or so an earlier seller claimed. Quote from eBay seller ddd9870 (same coin as noted above): Item was bought on numismatic auction in Russia in 2004. RWJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WCO Posted May 17, 2007 Report Share Posted May 17, 2007 It was or so an earlier seller claimed. Quote from eBay seller ddd9870 (same coin as noted above): Item was bought on numismatic auction in Russia in 2004. RWJ I have to correct myself, meant something different. Obviously the coin was in Russia in 1762 (if struck at the mint ), and may be in 2004. But it was sent from Poland to Latvia and now to the U.S. So it does not look as most recent owners violated the Russian law anyhow. WCO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheburgen Posted May 17, 2007 Report Share Posted May 17, 2007 It does not matter now where was the coin and where it is now. It's already been a mess that: 1.The coin was listed on 2 auctions simultaneously. 2. The seller on Ebay allowed to use his account to sell the coin which is not in his/her possesion. 3. The good name of the seller on Ebay is giving 100% guarantee to the questionable coin and the seller did not examine this coin since the coin not been in US yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldman Posted May 17, 2007 Report Share Posted May 17, 2007 It does not matter now where was the coin and where it is now. It's already been a mess that:1.The coin was listed on 2 auctions simultaneously. 2. The seller on Ebay allowed to use his account to sell the coin which is not in his/her possesion. 3. The good name of the seller on Ebay is giving 100% guarantee to the questionable coin and the seller did not examine this coin since the coin not been in US yet. Valid concerns. However, let me ask you: DOES IT REALLY MATTER HOW THE COIN GOT IN THE SELLER'S HANDS ? Also, do you realize how many Ebay sellers list consigned items based on photos only? It is a big business and , really, I do not see any issue here unless this coin is not genuine. And even here, seller's guarantee gives peace of mind to the buyer ! In any event, my point here is: we all are so scared with fakes and "fake" sellers that we can no (or do not want) longer enjoy this hobby Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheburgen Posted May 18, 2007 Report Share Posted May 18, 2007 Valid concerns. However, let me ask you:DOES IT REALLY MATTER HOW THE COIN GOT IN THE SELLER'S HANDS ? Will you buy a coin which was stolen? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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