bobh Posted April 27, 2008 Report Share Posted April 27, 2008 Proof of the contrary here: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...em=300219900997 Unless you believe that all those scratches are on the plastic, that is... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gxseries Posted April 27, 2008 Report Share Posted April 27, 2008 I'm going to go off track Bobh. Something puzzles me about the commemorative coins struck back then - were there proof coins for all types of commemorative rubles? I am more than aware of the proof 1834 column ruble, 1839 borodin ruble, 1896 coronation ruble but not too sure about the rest. Can anyone confirm it? For some reason I have never seen a 1913 Romanov ruble in proof although theoretically it should be possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexbq2 Posted April 27, 2008 Report Share Posted April 27, 2008 I'm going to go off track Bobh. Something puzzles me about the commemorative coins struck back then - were there proof coins for all types of commemorative rubles? I am more than aware of the proof 1834 column ruble, 1839 borodin ruble, 1896 coronation ruble but not too sure about the rest. Can anyone confirm it? For some reason I have never seen a 1913 Romanov ruble in proof although theoretically it should be possible. No proof Romanoff dynasty roubles were struck (to the best of my knowledge). They were meant to increase patriotism, and the belief in the monarchy amongst the gen. pop. Large quantities were struck but none for the wealthy collectors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobh Posted April 27, 2008 Author Report Share Posted April 27, 2008 No, proof Romanoff dynasty roubles were struck (to the best of my knowledge). They were meant to increase patriotism, and the belief in the monarchy amongst the gen. pop. Large quantities were struck but none for the wealthy collectors. I assume you meant this: "No proof Romanoff dynasty roubles were struck..." (i.e., without the comma ... the comma changes the meaning of the sentence to the exact opposite of what it means without the comma). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexbq2 Posted April 27, 2008 Report Share Posted April 27, 2008 I assume you meant this:"No proof Romanoff dynasty roubles were struck..." (i.e., without the comma ... the comma changes the meaning of the sentence to the exact opposite of what it means without the comma). Sorry, not sure how that got there. Didn't proof read. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grivna1726 Posted April 27, 2008 Report Share Posted April 27, 2008 I'm going to go off track Bobh. Something puzzles me about the commemorative coins struck back then - were there proof coins for all types of commemorative rubles? I am more than aware of the proof 1834 column ruble, 1839 borodin ruble, 1896 coronation ruble but not too sure about the rest. Can anyone confirm it? For some reason I have never seen a 1913 Romanov ruble in proof although theoretically it should be possible. 1859 Nicholas I memorial also exists in proof. The coin is common as a business strike, but rare in proof. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobh Posted April 27, 2008 Author Report Share Posted April 27, 2008 I'm going to go off track Bobh. Something puzzles me about the commemorative coins struck back then - were there proof coins for all types of commemorative rubles? I am more than aware of the proof 1834 column ruble, 1839 borodin ruble, 1896 coronation ruble but not too sure about the rest. Can anyone confirm it? For some reason I have never seen a 1913 Romanov ruble in proof although theoretically it should be possible. All of the commemorative coins between 1896-1914 exist in both proof and normal strikes except, as alexbq2 says, the 1913 Tercentenary rouble. The 1914 Gangut commemorative rouble also exists as mules with one side normal, the other side proof; these were two separate sets of restrikes of this coin, both made after the revolution, according to V.V. Kazakov (i.e., one set has a proof obverse and a regular reverse, the other set with a normal obverse and a proof reverse). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobh Posted April 27, 2008 Author Report Share Posted April 27, 2008 Can we get back on topic now?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SOMMER Posted April 27, 2008 Report Share Posted April 27, 2008 hello i 'm not a great numismat, but , i just can say that the 1 rouble 1883 coronation in proof grade exits ( based on world coins) i don t say that it is one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RARENUM Posted April 27, 2008 Report Share Posted April 27, 2008 You can find Proof Ruble>Link: http://coins.ha.com/common/view_item.php?S...mp;Lot_No=51838 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RARENUM Posted April 27, 2008 Report Share Posted April 27, 2008 Description from the Heritage"Alexander III. Coronation Rouble 1883, Bust right with date below/Value above crown and scepter in wreath, Bit-217, Uzd-4195, Proof 63 Cameo NGC. Fully mirrored fields with frosty devices. Very rare in Proof and the first that we have seen. " Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobh Posted April 27, 2008 Author Report Share Posted April 27, 2008 Description from the Heritage"Alexander III. Coronation Rouble 1883, Bust right with date below/Value above crown and scepter in wreath, Bit-217, Uzd-4195, Proof 63 Cameo NGC. Fully mirrored fields with frosty devices. Very rare in Proof and the first that we have seen. " Yes, but I am referring to the fact that the coin in my first post has obviously been harshly cleaned. As a rule, NGC will not slab coins which have been harshly cleaned, even if they are rare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Sisu Posted April 27, 2008 Report Share Posted April 27, 2008 The pic of the reverse seems to have a few scrapes that are on the slab. But the rest of those 'scratches' would make most DJs envious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RARENUM Posted April 27, 2008 Report Share Posted April 27, 2008 Yes, but I am referring to the fact that the coin in my first post has obviously been harshly cleaned. As a rule, NGC will not slab coins which have been harshly cleaned, even if they are rare. I'm the seller and can answer all your quthions.I would say more spetsifik my wife”Valeriya” help me and sell on eBay, if any question I can answer. 1. Coin with hairlines, on slab hairlines existing as well. Very hard focus the camera and I decide listed pictures as you see. 2. Coin not harshly cleaned, NGC REFUSED grading for harshly cleaned coins. 3. For last 10 years I have see 4 coins in Proof 4. Proof 63 Cameo NGC have hairlines >please refereed to link before ,toning cover proof for long period 100’ years and you can see only after light cleaning. Rarenum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kit Posted April 28, 2008 Report Share Posted April 28, 2008 Here is another example of slabbed coin with scratches at 6 'clock between II symbol: Peter II rouble 1727 SPB I have purchased it in 2005 from reputable eBay seller. It was in NGC slab at that moment. If I recall correctly the grade was VF 25. It seem to me that the nature of the scratches is from old cleaning. Opinions ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RARENUM Posted April 28, 2008 Report Share Posted April 28, 2008 Here is another example of slabbed coin with scratches at 6 'clock between II symbol:Peter II rouble 1727 SPB I have purchased it in 2005 from reputable eBay seller. I was in NGC slab at that moment. If I recall correctly the grade was VF 25. It seem to me that the nature of the scratches is from old cleaning. Opinions ? I just recently received from NGC not graded coin of 19th century with die break and description "Bended ". Sounds strange ,but possible deferent graders Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mummytrol Posted April 28, 2008 Report Share Posted April 28, 2008 Proof of the contrary here:http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...em=300219900997 Unless you believe that all those scratches are on the plastic, that is... Just plastic box seller e-bay# 310043785915. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RARENUM Posted April 28, 2008 Report Share Posted April 28, 2008 Just plastic box seller e-bay# 310043785915. Special link for "mummytrol" with the best prices for plastic boxes: http://www.redwholesale.com/products/plast...containers.aspx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexbq2 Posted April 28, 2008 Report Share Posted April 28, 2008 Completely an 'of the topic' remark, but this is the worst catalog of Russian Coins in existence! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...em=310043771451 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RARENUM Posted April 28, 2008 Report Share Posted April 28, 2008 Completely an 'of the topic' remark, but this is the worst catalog of Russian Coins in existence! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...em=310043771451 Agree,never used before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobh Posted April 28, 2008 Author Report Share Posted April 28, 2008 I'm the seller and can answer all your quthions.I would say more spetsifik my wife”Valeriya” help me and sell on eBay, if any question I can answer.1. Coin with hairlines, on slab hairlines existing as well. Very hard focus the camera and I decide listed pictures as you see. 2. Coin not harshly cleaned, NGC REFUSED grading for harshly cleaned coins. 3. For last 10 years I have see 4 coins in Proof 4. Proof 63 Cameo NGC have hairlines >please refereed to link before ,toning cover proof for long period 100’ years and you can see only after light cleaning. Rarenum. Hello David! Of course it is a very rare coin, and I'm sure someone will be happy to buy it. My remarks were not directed at you, but just in a general way about NGC and their policies. You say the coin was not harshly cleaned. Also, we see that the grade of PF-58 is not such a good grade for a proof coin. Since I cannot see other things wrong with this coin, it must be the hairline scratches which bring down the grade. And most of the time, such scratches come from improper (harsh) cleaning. The other coin (PF-63) is much better and has just a few marks and scratches. I would hesitate to say that they come from cleaning, but it is quite possible that they do. The PF-58 coin seems to have scratches over the entire surface, and they are pretty big for hairlines. But of course, it is impossible to say from looking at pictures (pictures taken through plastic). It would be nice if NGC adopted the practice of ANACS and printed "cleaned" on the holder, IMHO. Otherwise, say I had a rare proof U.S. Morgan dollar which had been cleaned like this coin ... would they slab it or not? ANACS would, NGC probably not. I think they should be more consistent. To me, this is very much "market grading", and I do not like the practice (I know that sellers LOVE it, though). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grivna1726 Posted April 28, 2008 Report Share Posted April 28, 2008 Completely an 'of the topic' remark, but this is the worst catalog of Russian Coins in existence! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...em=310043771451 I am unfamiliar with this book, having never seen or heard of it before now. What is it about the book that you dislike so much? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STEVE MOULDING Posted April 28, 2008 Report Share Posted April 28, 2008 Special link for "mummytrol" with the best prices for plastic boxes: http://www.redwholesale.com/products/plast...containers.aspx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexbq2 Posted April 28, 2008 Report Share Posted April 28, 2008 I am unfamiliar with this book, having never seen or heard of it before now. What is it about the book that you dislike so much? It caused me a lot of headaches. It was the second catalog I bought when I started collecting. The first was Rylov and Soblin. Uzdenikov was not easy to get at that time. I think the second edition had not come out yet, and the first came out in the 80s. So I only had 2 books, and Orlov’s has a ton of errors in it. Wrong images for coins, mixed up values for rare and common coins, etc… The problem was that I had no way of telling which book was right. It was very confusing. I did get the first edition of Uzdenikov in the end. At that point I knew which book had to go on the shelf (permanently). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grivna1726 Posted April 28, 2008 Report Share Posted April 28, 2008 It caused me a lot of headaches. It was the second catalog I bought when I started collecting. The first was Rylov and Soblin. Uzdenikov was not easy to get at that time. I think the second edition had not come out yet, and the first came out in the 80s. So I only had 2 books, and Orlov’s has a ton of errors in it. Wrong images for coins, mixed up values for rare and common coins, etc… The problem was that I had no way of telling which book was right. It was very confusing. I did get the first edition of Uzdenikov in the end. At that point I knew which book had to go on the shelf (permanently). Thank you. That makes it a lot clearer for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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