extant4cell

I got this book from Michael this week. Very impressed with his effort. I remember when he started collecting information 4 years ago and had an idea of making this catalog. I am glad to see his dream came true. This is only first edition. I am sure there will be corrections and additions as time will go by. Very good effort and well worth $30 odd bucks in full.

Kind of material that it already holds. VKGM etc catalogs' images, images of auctioned coins with ref to the auction houses they were sold through, anyone who can contribute pictures of their high quality coins. It also can be used as a tool for any numismatist that is researching a narrow field in details, for example 2 k 1802, or denga coins, or any other diverse group that requires data manipulation with coins characteristics entered in "variation" fields for cross referencing and systematization. A similar database (perhaps a copy of this one) will be built at a later stage, just for that purpose, that will have as many of these variation fields as possibly may be required. It may in future be cross referenced with the main database. There could be a number of databases built for different purposes. But it is all in future. First of all, the main database needs to be built, so people could see it's advantage over existing coin cataloging tools.

Entered a few coins just to try-out. See if you can play with: filter, search and group functions. May be add a few coins yourself and critisize the structure of this DB. I am trying to fine tune it so little would have to be changed later as those changes would affect great deal of data and it would have to be edited for every entry, I'd rather not be in that situation. Apparently it is easy to copy and past like this. Here is an example of grouping database by year and mint that I copied and pasted in my e-mail, it kept the stracture in the e-mail and in the Excell, with pictures incorporated. It can not do the same here, so I'll jus post an example in a picture form. Thank you.

Coin struck with stamps used in 1728 as you can see in the example above.

It looks almost like one of ancient roman coins as they find them in vessels, "preserved" in oil. Very thick patina, and you don't know what is underneath. I can see someone made patina cuts, to see what's under, is there metal visible? If the weight of the coin is good and even a little over, I would risk cleaning it. If not, most probably there is no more coin left under the patina, and in that case cleaning is not advisable. In the first instance, you may be up for a very nice surprise. These coins not thousand years old, after all, but even underneath "patina" of the roman coins, you can sometime find something interesting, or just ruin it, it's true, it's true...

I'd say you clean it first... For the moment all this "patina"-like dirt looks more like 1728 to me, but it is not the coins, it's its "patina" imprint that we can see, It can be anything under it...

Agree. What can I say, free webhosting comes with it's own price. Here are the direct links, bypassing my new pages, if you must prefer them: 1) Coin entry Form: https://MyTaskHelper.ru/apps/aqVy9BlivjCQjdbMucQ1BN/widgets/bVIhqvJfjdDl8TjJxAy-vd?view=bVIhqvJfjdDl8TjJxAy-vd 2) Database View: https://mytaskhelper.ru/widgets/aqVy9BlivjCQjdbMucQ1BN/bVIhqvJfjdDl8TjJxAy-vd You are also welcome to insert them into your own site in a frame using these links as long as you are actively participate in DB management. Can also provide you with iframe code as well if you will prefer that...

I have purchased the service for a year, so we have time to build the Online Russian Coins Database. It is in its testing stage now. You can find it here, in my new website: http://extant.wix.com/showcase#!russian-coins-image-data-base/c1wyu there still may be some fields that I'll have to add. So, experiment with it, add a few coin images etc. I will report later on what and how you can do to help with building this database. I am yet to write to auction houses for a permission to use their images. If that would be possible, this will speed up the job by a lot. So, keep watching this space, play with the database, get used to using it. Many things can be changed as time goes by (entry form can be re-designed for example), but the general view of database will be close to what you can see at the moment. All the entries in the database are made for demonstration only and will be replaced with better quality pictures of a better quality coins ... Please keep your comments coming, keep them short and constructive. Many thanks.

Hi Steve, I switched off the enlargement for the moment, experimenting with options. I don't like that it opens in a different page. Need to figure out what to do with this, I like when it is enlarged in the same window on the top of the page, but will need to figure out how to do that. It's all working moments that I'll get to as the time goes by. I paid for the database service a year ahead now and will start working on it. The database is in the early stage of development and I am planing to rebuild it in a bit different way, including more info. I don't want to rush with it, as it won't be easy to change the form options once many entries are made. Give me a little bit of time. I am also working on a web page at the moment where this database will be incorporated into. I'll show it to you in a week time, once it's up and running.

I guess it's a basic data-base to keep your collection in order. Very similar to Excell spreadsheet, only on line and with better filtering system... It can be utilized in different ways. Steve and all, thank you for your insiteful comments. I am not so much about making money. Have my job for that. This is a hobby, and I'd like to keep it that way. I think I found a way I may be able to host the data-base now without costing me a leg and an arm, and I may just pay for it myself, so the original idea is off the table. I'll get back to you in a new topic on this, once I am ready. Cheers!

Here is another one to try. Database of coins https://MyTaskHelper.ru/apps/aqVy9BlivjCQjdbMucQ1BN/widgets/bVIhqvJfjdDl8TjJxAy-vd?view=bVIhqvJfjdDl8TjJxAy-vdMake sure you try to use "Поиск" (search), "Фильтрация" (Filtering) and "Группировка" (grouping together). Although I need more entries there, but you can get an idea. Coin Entry Form https://mytaskhelper.ru/widgets/aqVy9BlivjCQjdbMucQ1BN/bVIhqvJfjdDl8TjJxAy-vd

Added a couple more and will add a few more later today. Sorry, busy with something else, but'll have them coming.

Surprise, surprise... I introduced the idea on CFN (Russian forum) and it was shot down by those, who usually shoot ideas that don't come from them or with their blessing... Didn't expect anything else... They want me to pay them for images of their coins... As it's not going to happen, I'll let them be for a while. Here is an example from the data-base, I have created "free" account, so unfortunately I have not discovered the way to publish it for public view. If I can not do that, I'll look for other platforms, or would have to pay. One other thing, this platform converts Russian text into jibrish after first edit manipulation. So may have to look for a platform that supports both. Any suggestions?

It has started out like that for me too, but i discovered the auctions and forums... And my life balancing hobby became an obsission. :-)

With real collectable coins, it's not a metal, but rarity that makes up the value.

Hi guys! I am playing around with a database that I discovered yesterday morning and that exited me enough to submerge myself in it completely, withdrawing from communication. Steve's fakes database that we worked on, really gave me a bit of a "gold rush" rush... (in a good sense). Now, that's great response and great questions. For the last 24 hours all I've been doing in my thinking space, was thinking about how it may work. That's what I think: It would be a database of some handpicked quality examples of coins that would cover all periods, not necessarily all variants (there are specific printed catalogs for this, like this one: http://coins.su/forum/index.php?showtopic=102869&hl= for example, that Michael just printed for 2 kopecks, it has great responses, and that I just ordered from him for $40. I remember when he just started his obsession in 2009). No need to replace the catalogs. And as you see not everything is free. I don't mind to pay for someone's hard work and for persistence, particularly when it is in the end a high quality product. Another example is Sincona 7. I paid for it good money (after sale) and love it. Yes, I hate to part with my hard earned "roubles", in a month I forget about it though, but love what I got in return. That's human nature I guess. And I know that I would love to see my own coins in some sort of quality publication. I keep catalogs where my coins left a trace. Only wished there were more or those. One thing I can promise, is that I will not favor any on my coins over anyone else's. That would defeat the purpose. Anyhow, one thing is to talk about it, another to see... Let's see what happens. Hope to show you an example really soon.

Thank you Sigi, this is very insightful! Keep them as modern copies from originals.

There was a lot of interest, that came up in criticism of fakes project that is now running and supported by Steve. This interest is in having an image database for normal collectible, real Russian coins (regular production and Novodels). People were saying something along the lines: "Why even bother building fakes image data-base when we don't have an image data-base for real coins!"... I sort of understand now, why it hasn't been done. I would anticipate some resistance there from dealers and collectors of catalogs , as that would be conflicting with their business / collection interests, so one needs to think how to approach this, being careful not to disturb the balance, as that would be the least thing that I would want to do. It's about making as many people happy, not sad or angry. Steve, you have the technology for this now, how would you approach this, if you were interested in doing this, so, as Russian proverb goes, it keeps wolves - fed and chickens - safe? I'll share my business idea and my thoughts on this, and even have a proposition for Steve. How about becoming a publisher of an annual and a master world collectors virtual and printed catalog!? As with any business you need to set up the rules that will drive it. Let's say, "no auction or printed materials pictures allowed, use only personally taken pictures from your own collection coins in a highest possible grade for that particular type/variety/rarity of the coin. Everyone can submit as many images as they like, given that they pay $1 per submitted image in order for us to process. Submitting an image of agreed quality guaranties it's insertion into the annual virtual catalog, and it's consideration, as it will be editor's choice, into the printed catalog. Once inserted into the virtual catalog, the image is becoming a shared property of the owner and of the catalog publisher". The virtual catalog can be published in a similar way as the fakes image data-base. It should be easy to keep the annual copies and a master catalog. That will make it a slower process, more involved for the admin, but more interesting for collectors who would be able to leave an electronic imprint from their coins in this catalog, adding some worthiness to their coins, if they haven't done so in the past catalogs, without the need to sell their coins! This would still keep the need for old catalogs as supportive materials with pictures from the past that may prove authenticity of the coins in hands, and auction sites for the same matter. I would do these catalogs annually, keeping electronic copies for viewing / reference, and actually printing them at the end of the year with reference to the owner (it can be a real name or their selected nick name), and start a new catalog at the beginning of the next. The best coins from all years can be entered into the master catalog with reference to the owner, until replaced with better examples. That way, instead of damaging the catalog business, we can bring something new into this business, satisfying the need for collectible virtual coins catalog and actually printing our own catalogs! I would be interested in driving this project with you, particularly that it may potentially bring in some money that I could use for my collection. It's not an altruistic project, if the $ sign not attached to it it would be very short lived and unfinished as we can see in many examples. In the future, it may even turn out into a new venture of setting up an additional branch and start auctioning the coins somehow, or doing private collection catalogs for people's collections if there will be interest, possibly even combining a few collections to make it more interesting... I think you need to be in partnership with someone in order to keep the drive. I know, that if I start something like this just by myself, there is a chance that the drive may pass, when you have a partner it's a lot easier as partners push each other a little, and some financial remuneration helps to keep that drive too. It won't be much money, but just enough to keep going. Would you be interested? It would be interesting what everyone thinks about this idea? Do you think this may work? Do you have any other interesting ideas?

Thank you Steve, we helped each other in this project and it worked. I couldn't do this without your help and it just happened that I wanted to do something like this for a while. I enjoyed doing it with you. I think I may return to my collection, although inertia still keeps me going, and today I collected a few more interesting images still for this project, and I'll add them soon. I finally had a look through the pictures provided by Candidate, there isn't much there that hasn't been added yet. I'll select a few images to add, but not going just to add them all in. (cut the rest for re-posting in Russian Coins Showcase Catalogue for Coins from Private Collections World-Wide: http://www.coinpeople.com/index.php/topic/33947-russian-coins-showcase-catalogue-for-coins-from-private-collections-world-wide/ )

I aimed to stop my obsession with fakes by the end of May, and I am now pretty much at the end of it now. The resource has over 400 coins now, and I am happy with what I managed to find and enter there. I will stop looking for fakes specifically now, and let them come to me as they usually do. I'll keep reporting them as I find them. Cheer!

I think it was worth researching and making a fool out of myself, if we got the the bottom of it at the end. It looks like a forgery for circulation to me, or is it a fake to fool collectors?

Neh, it's just a part of collector's life ...

Anything is possible. I simply don't know. Fakes come in different forms, not only the coins can be faked, The only true information that can be easily checked out is that some fake Nick II Chervontzy have gold concentration higher than the real Chervontzy and this story just provides one of possible explanations. ...You wont know the truth unless they let you in to the KGB archives. The trick will be to get out of it...

It's not mine... I was shown this coins when I discussed "yours", as an example of it not to be too exclusive. And I even argued for a sec that it was the same coin. Alas, I was quickly subdued with some cold water... Someone was selling it a while ago along with this one: truthfully calling it a copy... I am sure it would have a similar edge.

Over 370 examples of fakes entered - majority of what I came across, but far from all. Now it will slow down with new entries. Time for the next Kurnker on-line auction...