Livius Posted September 22, 2005 Report Share Posted September 22, 2005 - I have in my coin collection a Russian silver "Poltina" [1/2 Rouble] dated 1800. The coin is in VF condition and not cleaned all over. There is some wear but all the letters and the year 1800 are clearly visible. Marked with Cyrillic letters: "Not to us, Not to us, But in the honor of your name". My question is: What is the value of this silver coin in US dollars??? Thanks in advance for any help, Livius 09/22/05 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tane Posted September 22, 2005 Report Share Posted September 22, 2005 Hello and welcome! If the coin is genuine, it is rather valuable, about $300-400. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gxseries Posted September 23, 2005 Report Share Posted September 23, 2005 You should post a picture of your coin. Also, if I am not mistaken, if you see corrgulated edges instead of inscribed text on the coin, you most likely got a counterfeit coin. There are people who are starting to counterfeit such coins... *Edit: pardon me, I was falling asleep when I was typing this, I must have forgotten about this. If there is corrgulated edges, then it's not a counterfeit * Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Livius Posted September 23, 2005 Author Report Share Posted September 23, 2005 - Thanks for both replies. I cannot post pictures here with my WebTV. My e-mail address is Dora361@webtv.net and I can send to anyone who wants to help me the picture to post it here ["jpg" attachment]. I would appreciate any help. Please use as message subject "Russian Coin" not to delate it by mistake. I've had HARD time posting even this message here with my WebTV. Many thanks in advance, Livius 09/23/05 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gxseries Posted September 23, 2005 Report Share Posted September 23, 2005 Email sent. We are bloody quick in replying Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gxseries Posted September 23, 2005 Report Share Posted September 23, 2005 Pictures of Livius's coins. He does have some nice Russian coins. Tane, what do you think of the 1800 poltina? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tane Posted September 23, 2005 Report Share Posted September 23, 2005 Pictures of Livius's coins. He does have some nice Russian coins. Yes indeed he has! Great coins! Tane, what do you think of the 1800 poltina? I can't say for sure, on the other hand it has some "fakey" thing on its looks, some of the letters dont look right to me. How much it weighs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gxseries Posted September 23, 2005 Report Share Posted September 23, 2005 That is what I feared. The dimensions seem to agree, Livius said that the diameter is 3cm and the thickness is 1mm which is roughly similar to the catalogue. The only thing that is putting me off is the pittings on the coin which doesn't seem to be "silverish" unless this has been under the soil for a long period of time, and partially cleaned afterwards. I think Livius can elaborate the rest of questions that I couldn't manage to think of earlier on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tane Posted September 23, 2005 Report Share Posted September 23, 2005 To me the colour doesn't look like silver either It is most propably a fake. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gxseries Posted September 23, 2005 Report Share Posted September 23, 2005 Maybe, but the rest of the coins are definately genuine. That is something that I can guarantee at least. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tane Posted September 23, 2005 Report Share Posted September 23, 2005 I think so too. When comparing the poltina's colour and appearance to the others you can see quite clear difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Livius Posted September 24, 2005 Author Report Share Posted September 24, 2005 - My 1800 dated Poltina [1/2 Rouble] is made of silver. I got it in Romania in late 1960s from a private collection. The silver patina means NOTHING to me. If you take Iodine Tincture [2%] and using a small piece of cotton to rub a silver coin, the coin will get dark only if it is silver. To clean the dark patina from silver I use a mixture of Sodium Bicarbonate and a small amount of vinegar and rub the dark silver coin. If the coin is silver [and not a fake!], the coin will clean fast and easy. --- I will find out how much my 1800 dated Poltina weighs and let you guys know. I intend to sell all my silver Russian coins. Thanks for looking, Livius 09/24/05 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Livius Posted September 24, 2005 Author Report Share Posted September 24, 2005 - The dark spots from my 1800 dated silver Russian Poltina may be cleaned with an acid or using a brass wire brush or even better using brass wool. I don't want to do the cleaning. Those dark spots are sign of corrosion and I think the silver Poltina was kept in some bad place affected by various factors. I have this 1800 silver Poltina for many years [about 37-38 years] and I kept it in a tiny cardboard box away from other coins. Livius 09/24/05 NOTE: Most of the time I'm unable to post here anything with my primitive WebTV. I can be contacted at Dora361@webtv.net Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tane Posted September 25, 2005 Report Share Posted September 25, 2005 Cleaned coins aren't that desireable, you won't get a good price of a cleaned coin. Nearly all of the coins coin posted above are cleaned, and generally not so valuable as uncleaned specimens would have been. For example myself, I try to avoid cleaned coins. I dont like to have a cleaned coin in my collection, it just doesn't feel "right". My humble opinion only, please don't be offended by it. Whatever you do, don't rub them with anything, it will surely leave nasty scratches. You'll practicaly destroy the coins by using brass wools or wire brushes! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Livius Posted September 27, 2005 Author Report Share Posted September 27, 2005 - I do agree that too much cleaning is not good for any coin. At the same time a silver coin which was NEVER cleaned can be so dark and dirty that a picture will show nothing but a black piece of metal. --- I went yesterday to a jewelery store and my 1800 dated silver Poltina weighs 9.6 grams. Using vernier calipers I measured the coin diameter which is 30mm [or 30.1mm depending where I measured, the coin edge is worn] and the coin thickness is 1.7mm. On the side with Cyrillic "Not to us, Not to us, But in the honor of your name" inside of the frame these small letters can be read: "CM" [lower corner left] and "OM" [lower corner right]. The coin edge is "grained right". --- NOTE: I e-mailed both pictures [each side] of my 1800 dated silver Poltina to two different coin dealers [from USA where I live], both coin dealers having Russian names. Both coin dealers said NOTHING about my 1800 silver Poltina coin to be a "fake" and both would like to buy it. In this situation I assume that a coin dealer is not "dumb" enough to buy a fake Russian coin just to make me happy. I also assume that my 1800 dated Russian silver Poltina is NOT a fake like some of you guys think. Thanks for looking, Livius 09/27/05 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tane Posted September 27, 2005 Report Share Posted September 27, 2005 Fake it is, it should weigh nearly 11,4 grams. EDIT: 10,4 Grams ofcourse! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gxseries Posted September 27, 2005 Report Share Posted September 27, 2005 10.37grams according to my book. Look Livius, it would be faster and quicker if you sell the poltina to them. If we believe that it's a fake, there is no point trying to convience us, because we would only pay for what we believe it to be. Therefore, please do sell it to the dealers. If you don't want to sell it to them because they might rip you off, I'm sorry but I believe I did what I can. Tane, I believe I have posted a html table of the list of metal weights in the Russian coin article section. I don't know where you got the 11.4grams but I got mine from Uzedenikov... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tane Posted September 27, 2005 Report Share Posted September 27, 2005 I got my weight from Conros-cataloque, and it says 10,37 too. I ment to write "nearly 10,4" but pressed a wrong number. Nobody is perfect, noteven me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
banivechi Posted September 27, 2005 Report Share Posted September 27, 2005 I e-mailed both pictures [each side] of my 1800 dated silver Poltina to two different coin dealers [from USA where I live], both coin dealers having Russian names. Both coin dealers said NOTHING about my 1800 silver Poltina coin to be a "fake" and both would like to buy it. In this situation I assume that a coin dealer is not "dumb" enough to buy a fake Russian coin just to make me happy. I sold 3 months ago a fake of a 5 lei 1906 coin (contemporary fake) at the same price like a genuine one. Why? Because some people collect them! Contemporary fakes of roman coins are the subject of scientific researches in many countries. And, as I know, in the US is prohibited to sell a fake, so I think that a dealer who knows that is a fake, and maybe he have already client for this kind of coins, will NEVER tell you the truth about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tane Posted September 27, 2005 Report Share Posted September 27, 2005 The poltina most propably isn't a contemporary counterfeit, but a modern copy made for collectors. That's quite an expensive coin and fakes are very common. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
banivechi Posted September 27, 2005 Report Share Posted September 27, 2005 I still have the picture of fake 5 lei 1906 on my site - 1881-1914 section... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
banivechi Posted September 27, 2005 Report Share Posted September 27, 2005 I have one small Hungarian silver coin 10 Krajczar 1868 GyF found by a relative in my grandma's backyard (actually in the horses "garage"), who looks similar to this Poltina, and his weight is significant reduced. At cleaning, small parts exfoliated from coin, and became thick as a paper, but many of details are still visible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gxseries Posted September 27, 2005 Report Share Posted September 27, 2005 And here is a decent "example" of mine. 1839 Borodin ruble: (you all know how bloody rare this coin is) If I told you this is a genuine coin, And if this is a counterfeit one, I am sure you will find it not easy. *well it can be possible that BOTH of them are counterfeit * Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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