4 Kop.1762

[mihaizaha]

Hello guys!

I need your expertise on this one,I got this 1762 4 kopeks coin for some time.

Reading about them,I understand that are a lot of fakes floating around.This particular one its a week grade.

It messures 32,5mm,it is 3,1mm thick and 19,25g.

What s your opinion?

Thank you in advance!

 

 

 

[sirah]

I think it's original.

[sigistenz]

Agreed.

Sigi

 

 

 

-

[one-kuna]

looks original to me in low grade

[mihaizaha]

Thank you!

[mihaizaha]

The coin that i have,has nothing on its edge, i don t see any lettering or other markings.

I understand it should have some lettering .

What do you think?

[one-kuna]

does it have a net XXXXXXXXX ?

[mihaizaha]

No,nothing...some dents and bends but nothing else.

Now i m not home but next week i ll make some pictures.

I read that its need to have either some lettering or XXXX this one got

none.The only place i can check is my Krause catalog and

on line.I was hopping you guys got some others catalogues that are more

detalied.

Thanks a lot!

[extant4cell]

Any chance for a picture? It may have worn out...

[one-kuna]

krause is too far to learn russian coins, krause just for orientation on prices but sometimes even this a big problem for them

[extant4cell]

Examples of possible mints relation to these coins is presented in the article by Zverev in Nomizma 2010 issue 1, here is one picture from it:



Left->R T->Bottom: Peterburg, Moscow, Ekaterenburg
Sestroretsk, Yaroslavl(?), Nizhniy Novgorod(?), Porechye

for examples you cal look here http://www.m-dv.ru/m...,108/types.html

[mihaizaha]

I owe you an appology!

The edge does have XXXXX , its just in poor condition.

Sorry guys,i just didn t see it.

Mihai Z.

[sigistenz]

Examples of possible mints relation to these coins is presented in the article by Zverev in Nomizma 2010 issue 1, here is one picture from it:

 

1762 1 2 4 10 копеек барабанная арматура - возможные

 

Hi Eugene - this is very interesting! Does the dot arrangement apply also on the 10 kopeks of that series - or is there another scetch about those?

Thank you very much in advance,

Sigi

 

-

[sigistenz]

Examples of possible mints relation to these coins is presented in the article by Zverev in Nomizma 2010 issue 1, here is one picture from it:

 

1762 1 2 4 10 копеек барабанная арматура - возможные

 

Hi Eugene - this is very interesting! Does the dot arrangement apply also to the 10 kopeks of that series - or is there another sketch about those?

Thank you very much in advance,

Sigi

 

-

[extant4cell]

Hi Sigi, According to the author the dot arrangement was a permanent thing for each mint for all denominations of armature series. He was not completely eminent about Yaroslavl and Nizhniy Novgorod mints dot design ownership, it is his suspicion only. His theory is generally widely accepted now, due to findings of these coin designs closer to corresponding mints.

[sigistenz]

Hi Sigi, According to the author the dot arrangement was a permanent thing for each mint for all denominations of armature series. He was not completely eminent about Yaroslavl and Nizhniy Novgorod mints dot design ownership, it is his suspicion only. His theory is generally widely accepted now, due to findings of these coin designs closer to corresponding mints.

That is great information! Now I can determine my two 10kop1762 as from EM and from СПМ

Thank you very much indeed. BTW has the author or anybody else tried to distinguish the copper 5kop1758 (Ekaterinburg or Sestroretsk mints)?

I am very grateful to you

Sigi

 

-

[extant4cell]

I am sure there were at least some tries of distinguishing the 5 k coins of Elizabeth. If I'll come across such research, I'll let you know.

[alexbq2]

 

BTW has the author or anybody else tried to distinguish the copper 5kop1758 (Ekaterinburg or Sestroretsk mints)?

I am very grateful to you

Sigi

 

-

All I know is that the coins with pretty, Dassier looking, eagles are considered to be from Sestroretsk. I guess the frazzled ones are from Ekaterinburg.

[kaostram]

That is great information! Now I can determine my two 10kop1762 as from EM and from СПМ

Thank you very much indeed. BTW has the author or anybody else tried to distinguish the copper 5kop1758 (Ekaterinburg or Sestroretsk mints)?

I am very grateful to you

Sigi

 

-

Ekaterinburg/Sestroretsk

[alexbq2]

Welcome Kaostram! And thank you for the info.

 

Can anyone tell me how to destinguish 1793 EM Paul overstrikes by mint?

[sigistenz]

Ekaterinburg/Sestroretsk

Hi Andrey, welcome back. Could you explain your picture of the 2 pieces of 5kop1758? Where is the information from, based on what, etc

The only difference that I see is the orb being higher or lower than the end of the scroll.

Thank you very much,

Sigi

-

[extant4cell]

Hi Sigi and all,

 

Andrey asked me to translate this for you:

 

The difference is in orb as most easily identifiable difference that helps to determine the mint in 5-kopecks 1758, but not exclusively in orb. 5-s in the year differ as well, also Yekaterinburg mint 5 kopecks are often with over-date 58 from 57. The information comes from Evdokimov's research, that is not published yet. The discussion took place on CFN. It's in Russian, but you may scan through it if interested: http://coins.su/foru...howtopic=101759

 

The other thing that Andrey mentioned is that the identification 1762 series is not as widely accepted as I thought. He gave an example, discussion on CFN; http://coins.su/forum/index.php?showtopic=101549&st=200&hl&do=findComment&comment=1116685

 

To start with different nominals had different dot allocation (not matching to all nominals), that was made to protect coins from forgeries. I have no time at the moment to read it all and extract it here, but I'll try to do that a little later. In any case, the table I showed has been criticized, and not entirely reliable.

[sigistenz]

Thank you very much both of you.

Sigi

 

-