Unknown Ancient?

[Hussulo]

Can anyone help with what this coin might be?

 

 

I think it may be a cast/forgery, but I was wondering of what type?

 

I took it down to my local jeweller and he tested it and said its at least 22k on his tester, could be higher but his tester doesn't go any higher.

 

Any help would be grateful.

 

Thanks,

Hus

[YeOldeCollector]

As posted on CoinsGBForum.com

 

Looks a lot like this:

 

Osca, Spain. AR Denarius. 204-154 BC. Head right with short beard, legend resembling '*N' behind / horseman galloping right with spear, Iberian legend resembling '*PMAN' = BOLSCAN below. Burgos 1501, Villaronga 3, CNH 6.

[Hussulo]

Wow Super fast answer. Thanks Clive.

 

We've since ascertained that it should weigh 4 grams and be roughly 18.5 mm in diameter.

 

I just checked.

 

This one is 3.6grams and about 15mm in diameter.

 

To me that rules out it being made from gold as it should weigh more, unless of course its on a much thinner planchet.

 

Makes me wonder why the jeweller said it was gold 22k+ he even offered to buy it from me.

[jlueke]

Wow Super fast answer. Thanks Clive.

 

We've since ascertained that it should weigh 4 grams and be roughly 18.5 mm in diameter.

 

I just checked.

 

This one is 3.6grams and about 15mm in diameter.

 

To me that rules out it being made from gold as it should weigh more, unless of course its on a much thinner planchet.

 

Makes me wonder why the jeweller said it was gold 22k+ he even offered to buy it from me.

 

It could be easily be real gold, many cast and struck replicas and forgeries were made in good metal.

[Hussulo]

It could be easily be real gold, many cast and struck replicas and forgeries were made in good metal.

 

Were there any gold coins of these type made? what's your opinion of it?

 

I can't see a join on the edge but the surface does appear rough which makes me think pretty definite fake, but I have practically no knowledge of ancients. If an ancient gold coin was dug there shouldn't really be much damage to the surface i.e. corrosion should there? Gold to my knowledge is quite a resistant metal.

[jlueke]

Were there any gold coins of these type made? what's your opinion of it?

 

I can't see a join on the edge but the surface does appear rough which makes me think pretty definite fake, but I have practically no knowledge of ancients. If an ancient gold coin was dug there shouldn't really be much damage to the surface i.e. corrosion should there? Gold to my knowledge is quite a resistant metal.

Did your jeweler test just the surface? Do you see anything besides gold under the first layer?

It could be a gold plated copy, it could be a gold plated original denarius, or something else.

I don't see this type in gold, so it seems more likely to be a copy or an alteration.

But it could be a real gold copy and have some value, or a real coin plated which would also have some value.

[28Plain]

Did your jeweler test just the surface? Do you see anything besides gold under the first layer?

It could be a gold plated copy, it could be a gold plated original denarius, or something else.

I don't see this type in gold, so it seems more likely to be a copy or an alteration.

But it could be a real gold copy and have some value, or a real coin plated which would also have some value.

Testing for gold content would quickly reveal plated surfaces. A plated or gold filled coin will leave a test streak on the stone that is heavily mixed with the base metal substrate and would burn away as soon as the acid solution covers it. When tested with an electronic tester, a plated or gold filled fake will test as base metal even if the overlay is a heavy layer of applied gold leaf.

 

Cast copies of coins made for use in jewelry are usually cast in gold alloy or fine gold because it isn't worth the effort to cast one in base metal and plate it. That kind of work is usually done at the order of a customer and few jewelry lovers would want a plated coin mounted to wear as jewelry. If this is a coin of a type which was struck in silver only, it's probably a cast copy made for use in jewelry. I've seen men's rings made of 18k with 22 or 24k ancient coins set in them, and have seen pendants made of gold coins, too. Many of them turn out to be cast copies, though made of gold alloy or fine gold.

 

The surfaces on the reverse of the coin look like it's a cast copy. It's nice, though. The jeweler knew what he was offering to buy, surely.

[Drusus]

I similar coin won the coin idol contest recently if I am not mistaken, a very nice, slightly later example of the type:

 

[28Plain]

If an ancient gold coin was dug there shouldn't really be much damage to the surface i.e. corrosion should there? Gold to my knowledge is quite a resistant metal.

 

In fact, gold is a non-reactive metal. 22k and higher coins would be practically impervious to corrosion when buried. The roughness of the surface is more likely from the casting process and is an indicator that the coin is a cast copy rather than a struck coin.

[jlueke]

In fact, gold is a non-reactive metal. 22k and higher coins would be practically impervious to corrosion when buried. The roughness of the surface is more likely from the casting process and is an indicator that the coin is a cast copy rather than a struck coin.

 

One word of caution here. Roughness done by casting, for good casts, can't be seen by the human eye it's only apparent under magnification. Of course the more crudely cast the more obvious it becomes. But there's other ways gold coins can look rough.

[Drusus]

Just to be completely clear...gold is reactive...just far less reactive to oxidation. It reacts but isnt reactive (or is very resistant) to much of the same things other metals are reactive to...but gold is NOT non-reactive. As for the roughness of casting...as said above...there are casting techniques that would make it much harder to see evidence of casting...and there is certainly other ways that it could become rough...though I think this IS a casting because of what I see happening close to the edge, I dont think it was struck.