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Kinky ducat question


Blackhawk
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Does anyone know anything about ducats? This one is from 1612, but I can't figure out where exactly that it's from. I believe it's from the Netherlands, but it looks a bit different than the other 1612 ducats that I can find on the internet in that the lettering on the obverse is different. This one says CONCORDIA.PAR C RES. FRI. - the others that I can find have a slightly different legend. This one has the letter C between the legs of the figure...I believe that the otheras have the letter P in the same spot. There is a small rearing lion after the FRI. - is this the mintmark? Other than that, the coin has decent detail, but appears to have been bent a few times and it's a little kinky. :ninja: The reverse is rotated about 45 degrees counterclockwise. Can anyone lend some insight into the coin's orgin and value? Thanks!

 

 

1612ducat1.jpg

1612ducat2.jpg

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Yep, it's from the Netherlands - the province of Friesland. The rampant lion is the mint mark. Those wavy flans are common for provincial ducats; I have one from Westfriesland that makes me seasick.

 

The inscription on the obverse is "Concordia par cres." You've probably seen ducats with the P in par falling between the soldier's feet, rather than the C in cres. The inscription varies.

 

There's a 1612/07 overstrike, and I wonder if yours could be one? My Krause is from 2003, but for what it's worth it lists both the overstrike and the regular type as: F 150 VF 275 EF 375.

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Yep, it's from the Netherlands - the province of Friesland. The rampant lion is the mint mark. Those wavy flans are common for provincial ducats; I have one from Westfriesland that makes me seasick.

 

 

Were they wavy because of manufacturing technique, or because they got bent in use because of their thin flans?

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That is one odd ducat. Must say I have never seen the like. This is what the coin should look like -

 

1612_Neth_ducat_obv.jpg

 

 

 

1612_Neth_ducat_rev.jpg

 

 

 

Now, I am not saying that the coin is a fake, it may be genuine. But I've never seen one like it and I've seen a lot of ducats. Just about everything is different or out of place. And they were quite particular about all of the coins being the same.

 

Have you weighed and measured the coin ? It should be 3.5 grams and 22mm. If it isn't, then I would have to say it is definitely suspect.

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The RES is missing in the legend. The lettering in the legend is doubled in some areas. I'll have to do some more homework on it.

 

 

Check the style of the letters on both sides and compare them to mine, check the numbers as well. Then look at the design of the knight etc etc.

 

Keep in mind though, the coin may be the right weight & size, may even be made of gold and still be a fake. As I said - only an in hand exam by someone who knows will tell you for sure.

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The coin weighs 3.5 grams, which makes it's size and weight correct I guess. I'm going to try and contact a dealer in the Netherlands and see if I can find out any more about it.

 

 

By all means do so. You might try and contact Fred G. van den Haak - he knows more about Netherlands coinage than just about anyone in the world - shop@reyes.stanford.edu

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