1834 Large Cent

[sbvenman]

Hey Everybody,

 

This is my first actual post, so I hope my pictures work. I recently aquired this 1834 large cent at an auction. Liberty looks like she has a double die error. The picture shows her two sets of lips very clearly. I don't know though if this is truly considered a double die. I understand that those types of errors happen either because of an error in the die or because of a restrike. I was hoping someone can shed some light on this for me.

 

Thanks,

Scott

 

 

[bill]

It looks double struck to me. Maybe our large cent specialists know better.

 

Welcome to Coin People!

[AuldFartte]

Welcome to CoinPeople

 

In the pre-1840 era, the machinery used to strike US coinage was less advanced than later stuff, and some of the coins were prone to being doubled due to "looseness" in machines or problems with pressure causing a double hit. Minor doubling can be found on a lot of coins of this era, but yours is a very nice example. Does the doubling appear on the stars or on any of the reverse features?

 

I'd think it was safe to call yours a doubled die based on the magnitude of that doubling. Very cool coin

[sbvenman]

I've always wondered exactly how double dies actually came to be. Thanks for the explanation. I can't find any other doubling on the stars or reverse. This was my first double die coin, so I am pleased.

 

Thanks,

 

Scott

[bill]

Welcome to CoinPeople

 

In the pre-1840 era, the machinery used to strike US coinage was less advanced than later stuff, and some of the coins were prone to being doubled due to "looseness" in machines or problems with pressure causing a double hit. Minor doubling can be found on a lot of coins of this era, but yours is a very nice example. Does the doubling appear on the stars or on any of the reverse features?

 

I'd think it was safe to call yours a doubled die based on the magnitude of that doubling. Very cool coin

 

Double die or double struck? I believe you describe the process for a double strike (true for a double die as well, but I believe you are referring to the coins presses and not the hubbing equipment). If it is a double die, it should be a documented variety (my large cent books are packed away, so I can't check) or very rare. The doubling seems too prominent to not be a major variety if truly a double die.

[sbvenman]

I just did some more research on this coin and found this information about one that sold in an auction a few years ago.

 

Newcomb-2¾;

Rarity-1… Faint triple profile on upper lip, double on forehead, lower lip and chin.

 

That description follows the error pretty closely. Thanks for the help.

 

-Scott

[Art]

I just got my books out and checked on the 1834s. I don't know what variety your cent is and can't really tell much from the pictures. Wright in his book notes that many of the 34s have doubling of different kinds.

 

I don't understand the Newcomb number. If it's a 34-2 then it is an R1 and is considered common in all grades. Please note that when the literature on large cents talks about "common" they are not talking about what many people would consider common. 34-2 is the most common of the 1834s. Wright's estimate is that there are more than 300 in MS and more than that in AU. He also notes that between 1/3 and 1/4 of all this years coins are chatter strikes.

 

Chatter Strike - A doubling of some parts of a coin image that is imparted in striking rather than cut into the fie. This results from a worn or loose press mechanism that permits a bounce on each impact. These are found on most varieties of cents before 1835 and are quite prevalent from 1832-1835. Definition from The Cent Book by John D. Wright.

[AuldFartte]

I just got my books out and checked on the 1834s. I don't know what variety your cent is and can't really tell much from the pictures. Wright in his book notes that many of the 34s have doubling of different kinds.

 

I don't understand the Newcomb number. If it's a 34-2 then it is an R1 and is considered common in all grades. Please note that when the literature on large cents talks about "common" they are not talking about what many people would consider common. 34-2 is the most common of the 1834s. Wright's estimate is that there are more than 300 in MS and more than that in AU. He also notes that between 1/3 and 1/4 of all this years coins are chatter strikes.

 

Chatter Strike - A doubling of some parts of a coin image that is imparted in striking rather than cut into the fie. This results from a worn or loose press mechanism that permits a bounce on each impact. These are found on most varieties of cents before 1835 and are quite prevalent from 1832-1835.  Definition from The Cent Book by John D. Wright.

 

That's kinda what I was trying to say, but messed it up

Wright puts it SOOOO much better

[Art]

That's kinda what I was trying to say, but messed it up

Wright puts it SOOOO much better

 

 

You hit it on the head. The Wright stuff was just to level set a bit on what is meant by common for Large Cents and to define chatter in case folks run across the term.