Prussian Thaler 1765 (A)

[alexbq2]

I don't really collect these, but I've procured one by chance a long time ago. I've done some searching on the net, but did not find much. I can only conclude that they are somewhat rare.

 

I would rather appreciate any practical information with regard to this coin and the series? Are they common or rare, popular or only collected in highest grades? Is Berlin (A) mint regarded differently than other mints? Any estimates for one in about F grade?

[justapeek]

This is a Prussian Taler 1795 in aVF preservation. It should be a little bit better than your F coin. You can also see the selling value, that's quite modest and indicates a common coin I guess. I can't answer about the mint, but I think that Berlin would be also common: even the mintmark of the coin in my link seems to be (A).

[alexbq2]

This is a Prussian Taler 1795 in aVF preservation. It should be a little bit better than your F coin. You can also see the selling value, that's quite modest and indicates a common coin I guess. I can't answer about the mint, but I think that Berlin would be also common: even the mintmark of the coin in my link seems to be (A).

 

Thank You for your reply.

 

I’m actually a bit surprised by your answer. As I mentioned, I do not know much about German numismatics. I actually hang out on the Russian coin side of the forum. Can’t say I know much about coin collecting in general, but specifically in Russian numismatics, coins are classified by: Type (including denomination), Year, Mint, Mintmaster. On top of that there are some smaller variations in stylistic elements, but not everyone cares about that.

 

I’m curious if the same system applies to German numismatics? Or is one silver thaler considered pretty much the same as another? Or is variation purely by type and all years of issue are considered the same?

 

From your answer, it appears that a 1765 thaler is analogous to a 1795 thaler in spite of 30 years between them, in which both the rulers of Prussia and the design of coins changed. So do collectors of German coins not care about these “small” differences?

[justapeek]

You are absolutely right, and I have to excuse for my hasty answer. Of course they are different, '65 is not '95 and viceversa. I just lost the right year when searching for your coin around the web... and I made confusion, sorry again

 

Well, all the elements you mentioned are important to determine the value of an old coin, I guess in Germany as well as elsewhere. And if you are not expert about that exact kind of coin, could be difficult to find the mintage. This is true especially if you collect older coins, and you are just a modest collector: as I am.

 

But your coin is recent, so the Krause 1701-1800 would help a lot: before I was in office, and I couldn't look at it. Unfortunately, even changing the year, the coin still remains common and not so expensive. This is the page with Prussian Thaler 1765A in evidence... if I well understand how the Krause works, of course

 

[alexbq2]

Thank you for your answer! And thanks for the scan!

 

I'm surprised I'm not seeing any resent sales records.

[ccg]

Due to Prussia being one of the larger European states at the time, it's coins are generally common (relatively compared to others) and as such are unlikely to be sold via auction.

[justapeek]

Not at all for the scan

 

About the auctions, I think that ccg would be right in his answer. In fact, I had to search accurately before to find some of them sold in auction.

 

For example, during the Heritage World Coin Auction #3000 at Long Beach, came out an amazing piece dated 1764(F), of which you can see the scan below.

 

Looking on Krause, I can deduct that 176X (F) Thalers would be less common than 176X (A) because the estimation of high preservation (F) pieces, about 850 US$, is nearly three times higher than (A), about 350 US$. But the price asked at HWCA3000 was much, much higher: 3000-3500 US$, as demonstration that the rarity - and conseguently the real price - of such kind of coins is determined by the number of pieces around with the same preservation state, patina, tone, sharp details and so on.

 

[alexbq2]

Due to Prussia being one of the larger European states at the time, it's coins are generally common (relatively compared to others) and as such are unlikely to be sold via auction.

 

I've also checked ebay last weekend, and nothing came up. At any rate I just found this site:

http://www.coinfactswiki.com/wiki/Prussia_...thaler_Dav-2586

 

"Silver thalers of eighteenth century Prussia are scarce as her issues were lighter and lower in fineness than those of neighboring states such as Saxony and Hannover. These coins were spent and the others hoarded. Despite Frederick the Great's strenuous efforts to build up the local economy, Prussia remained a poor and backward country. This type was struck 1764-75 at Berlin (mintmark "A"), Konigsburg (mintmark "E"), Magdeburg (mintmark "F") and Cleve (mintmark "C")."

[ccg]

If a coin is of poorer content ("bad money") then I would expect it to have a higher than normal survival rate, and usually in lower grades as better pieces are saved and/or melted.

[ccg]

Then again, with the currency changes after unification, a lot of the older coins would had just dissappeared.