bobh Posted February 28, 2008 Report Share Posted February 28, 2008 Some strange opening prices here: 3 Roubles 1835. Platinum Rouble, 1842-АЧ (XF details) I bought my 1842 rouble about two years ago in Basel (the last time the "World Money Fair" was held there) in similar condition for only CHF 50. It turned out to be an overdate (1842/1)! Now as to the platinum piece, weighing in at slightly more than 10g, there is more than $700 worth of platinum in that coin at today's prices. This coin will easily realize two or three times that amount, IMHO. I sometimes wonder who sets the prices for these auctions? Perhaps the assigning seller? Maybe these coins came from different collectors, each with their own idea of what they think the coin is worth? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STEVE MOULDING Posted February 28, 2008 Report Share Posted February 28, 2008 Bob...why confused? Any auction house will be conservative. If they estimate low, then they can trumpet their sale as being successful, easily exceeding expectations, etc. If they over-estimate they'll scare bidders away and will look like chumps if many lots don't hit the estimate. I almost never go by their estimates. If I did I'd never win anything. Know what something is worth (and you clearly do) and bid accordingly. Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maya Posted February 28, 2008 Report Share Posted February 28, 2008 Some strange opening prices here: 3 Roubles 1835. Platinum Rouble, 1842-АЧ (XF details) I bought my 1842 rouble about two years ago in Basel (the last time the "World Money Fair" was held there) in similar condition for only CHF 50. It turned out to be an overdate (1842/1)! Now as to the platinum piece, weighing in at slightly more than 10g, there is more than $700 worth of platinum in that coin at today's prices. This coin will easily realize two or three times that amount, IMHO. I sometimes wonder who sets the prices for these auctions? Perhaps the assigning seller? Maybe these coins came from different collectors, each with their own idea of what they think the coin is worth? You are right, there seems to be no consistency in these prices. I don't think the same person could have assigned them. Neither is realistic, but it would have marginally made more sense to have the estimates reversed. I say marginally because it appears to me that the estimate for the 1842 rouble would still be too high, especially if, as Steve said, they are looking to remain conservative. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marv Posted February 29, 2008 Report Share Posted February 29, 2008 Bob...why confused? Any auction house will be conservative. If they estimate low, then they can trumpet their sale as being successful, easily exceeding expectations, etc. If they over-estimate they'll scare bidders away and will look like chumps if many lots don't hit the estimate. I almost never go by their estimates. If I did I'd never win anything. Know what something is worth (and you clearly do) and bid accordingly. Steve Hi Steve. I'm a fellow RNS member. One thing you said caught my attention: "Know what something is worth...". How does one do that in today's Russian coin market? For example, I was interested in the gorgeous 1803 Rouble in the recently completed UBS auction 74. Estimate was CHF 7500. I know it would go for "more," but CHF 40,000??? Yikes. How can anyone know what something is worth today. A 1901 poltina in an NGC PF67 holder with beautiful toning, estimate CHF 1500 (!) went for CHF 30,000!!!! 20 times estimate. I mean being conservative with the estimates if one thing; being that far off means that UBS, and probably anyone else, has absolutely no idea what a nice Russian coin will bring in today's Russian-dominated market. I feel fortunate that I bought some very nice coins out of the Hesselgesser sales between 2000 and 2004. I probably couldn't touch them now. Another example of this is in the recently completed Triton XI sale. Again, the Russian coins went out of sight. I assume you'll report on these important sales in the next issue of the RNS journal. And, by the way, it would be helpful if you reported the grades for the choice coins. It's hard to make sense out of the PR when one has no idea that this coin was a PF67 and this other coin was a PF61, but both are reported as "proof." I don't know when this fire will die down, but right now it's burning furiously. Marv Finnley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobh Posted February 29, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 29, 2008 Bob...why confused? Because CHF 800 for a circulated (and scratched) common-date rouble is much too high, and CHF 400 for ANY platinum coins ridiculously low! Just last summer, the Hess-Divo auction of that Japanese collector's beautiful Russian collection had estimates of "only" CHF 500 for roubles of that period, but those were beautiful AU/UNC specimens. Yes, they did go mostly over that. Interestingly enough, they had set the opening price for a 1913 Romanov rouble at CHF 1,000. When the bidding started, they had to start at CHF 200 and went DOWN to about CHF 120 from there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STEVE MOULDING Posted March 1, 2008 Report Share Posted March 1, 2008 Because CHF 800 for a circulated (and scratched) common-date rouble is much too high, and CHF 400 for ANY platinum coins ridiculously low! Ahh...I see. As your original post mostly talked about one of the coins being grossly under-estimated I hadn't realized you thought one was grossly over-estimated. My mistake! I still think estimates are normally skewed low, but in this case maybe these guys really just don't know :-) Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobh Posted March 5, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 5, 2008 Here are the prices realized: Tkalic auction As I expected, the 1842 rouble in VF+ did not sell. However, some AMAZING prices were reached! Gold coins of Alexander III went to over $10,000 for every lot, even exceeding the prices for some older gold coins such as this 10 rouble coin of Catherine II, 1766: 1766, Catherine II ten roubles gold (realized CHF 6,000) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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