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1729 rouble offered on La Galerie Numismatique Auction, NY ! Fake ?


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The lot can be viewed on La Galerie Numismatique website:

http://www.coins-la-galerie-numismatique.c...1&catno=254

 

Or through eBay live:

http://cgi1.liveauctions.ebay.com/ws/eBayI...9415#la-image-1

 

What do you think ?

 

For comparison purposes, here is the "La Galerie Numismatique" coin, followed by pictures of a 1729 rouble currently being offered on ebay by a seller in China (ebay item #120209184086)

lgnam0.jpg

17291cnry4.jpg17292cnrl9.jpg

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For comparison purposes, here is the "La Galerie Numismatique" coin, followed by pictures of a 1729 rouble currently being offered on ebay by a seller in China (ebay item #120209184086)

[images snipped]

Perhaps both are fake, but they are definitely done from different dies. There are enough differences if you look closely. Can anyone post a picture of the genuine item?

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Perhaps both are fake, but they are definitely done from different dies. There are enough differences if you look closely. Can anyone post a picture of the genuine item?

I have looked at these carefully and tend to disagree that they are not the same.

 

It is true that there are differences in some of the letters but the Chinese fakes are

made from molds, not dies, and such molds would crumble and distort over time.

 

I am therefore of the opinion that both of the pieces are bad and from China.

 

RWJ

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I have looked at these carefully and tend to disagree that they are not the same.

 

It is true that there are differences in some of the letters but the Chinese fakes are

made from molds, not dies, and such molds would crumble and distort over time.

 

I am therefore of the opinion that both of the pieces are bad and from China.

 

RWJ

 

There are surface imperfections (depressions and blems) which are common to both pieces in the fields.

 

Both have an (almost?) identical "flan flaw" above the crown at 9 o'clock, nearly at the edge.

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There are surface imperfections (depressions and blems) which are common to both pieces in the fields.

 

Both have an (almost?) identical "flan flaw" above the crown at 9 o'clock, nearly at the reverse edge.

 

BTW, if you look at the ebay auction, you'll find that the Chinglish in the description has improved markedly.

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In early November I downloaded several photographs of coins being offered by this same

seller, all of which I had doubts about. One of the coins was this same 1729 rouble offered

at present. (The photograph is the same.) I do not know, however, if it sold in November.

 

RWJ

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The following coins sold by this seller are all very doubtful and the low prices they

brought indicate that others had the same view:

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...em=230193126300

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...em=230193127096

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...em=230193124930

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...em=230189388009

 

Two of the feedbacks openly accused the seller of offering fakes. The first of the above items

(1740 poltina) was published in the RNS Journal as a fake.

 

RWJ

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The following coins sold by this seller are all very doubtful and the low prices they

brought indicate that others had the same view:

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...em=230193126300

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...em=230193127096

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...em=230193124930

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...em=230189388009

 

Two of the feedbacks openly accused the seller of offering fakes. The first of the above items

(1740 poltina) was published in the RNS Journal as a fake.

 

RWJ

 

In my opinion, coins 1, 3 and 4 are not genuine and I am astonished that they even achieved the low selling prices they did. I cannot see pictures of coin #2 in the link provided, so that one is unknown to me, but the low price is probably a reliable indicator.

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Ebay Seller "Wolrd-History-is Reflected in-Coins" was previously known as "Sales-lora", who has had many Russian fakes in the past 2 years. He or She just changed ebay names.

Thanks, I had forgotten the original name. I had some correspondence with sales-lora and

she claimed that her late husband had been an expert in Russian coins and that she was

selling off his collection.

 

RWJ

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The lot can be viewed on La Galerie Numismatique website:

http://www.coins-la-galerie-numismatique.c...1&catno=254

 

Or through eBay live:

http://cgi1.liveauctions.ebay.com/ws/eBayI...9415#la-image-1

 

What do you think ?

The hammer price was $750, which – in my opinion – is about $745 more than it is worth.

 

RWJ

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Did anyone try to contact the Galerie Numismatique about this coin ?

I have reported them about this coin by email and received read confirmation email,

however there was no formal reply. ;)

 

It appears the auction went ahead anyway, despite your warning, and the coin sold to a floor bidder.

 

Galerie Numismatique just made my list of people to avoid. :ninja:

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I remember this seller under the prior name and I actually made her an offer for several higher end pieces (1 & 2 rouble gold pieces), from this late husband's collection. I guess I was lucky that she wanted more than I was willing to spend....or waste in this case.

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So far this auction house was pain in the ass, I purchased Gold 1778 Poltina from them, but now I think it's been bended. They also sent me an invoice with applied NY sales tax and extremely high shipping fee. I still don't have any problem with paying the total, but they won't answer my emails if this coin is bended or not.

 

What do you guys think, is it bended or not - http://cgi.liveauctions.ebay.com/ws/eBayIS...em=150195819622

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So far this auction house was pain in the ass, I purchased Gold 1778 Poltina from them, but now I think it's been bended. They also sent me an invoice with applied NY sales tax and extremely high shipping fee. I still don't have any problem with paying the total, but they won't answer my emails if this coin is bended or not.

 

What do you guys think, is it bended or not - http://cgi.liveauctions.ebay.com/ws/eBayIS...em=150195819622

 

I can't tell if it was bent from the picture. I see what looks like some possible waviness in the fields of the coin, but I don't see any distortion of the portrait or reverse devices.

 

These coins are very thin and it wouldn't take much force to bend one.

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