extant4cell Posted June 18, 2013 Report Share Posted June 18, 2013 If anyone has this variant of the narrow monogram 2 kopecks 1797 AM, Can you please let me know its actual weight? The reason for asking... As I am going through VKGM catalog, describing different variants of coins at the moment, and finding interesting facts for myself. For example, I noticed 3 different variants of this coin type. But this variant is the most interesting, and looks like, one of the rarest ones. VKGM didn't have this narrow monogram coin in his collection. He described in his catalog the coin from the collection of Count Tolstoy. The most interesting is the thing that he wrote in the description: "2 kopecks. Av. Similar to design in description for number 10. Rev: 2. | КОПЕЙКИ | 1797 | A.M. From Count Tolstoy's collection. (Edge : cord to the right.) Weight of this coin is almost double of the other 2 kopecks of Emperor Paul I."It would be most interesting to find such a heavy version. I haven't heard so far, that someone would have a coin with anomaly in weight so noticeable. So far, the heaviest coins I am aware of is 21.4 g. 1-2 grams here or there was acceptable in these coins. What Tolstoy had in his collection, according to VKGM was nearly twice as heavy. Please let me know what's your coin weight is. I am very curious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IgorS Posted June 18, 2013 Report Share Posted June 18, 2013 There a huge discussion on the varieties of narrow monogram on coins.su. You probably have seen it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
extant4cell Posted June 18, 2013 Author Report Share Posted June 18, 2013 I haven't read it all, but I have noticed they discussed the design varieties there after I analyzed the market and noticed 3 groups myself yesterday, so the discovery was still exiting for me. They didn't bring up the question of weight before though, and I am interested to know the heaviest weight of this type. The heaviest reported there now is 22.95 g, but it's in a different variant grouping. https://mytaskhelper.ru/widgets/aqVy9BlivjCQjdbMucQ1BN/dtype/dwtCM0Pq9lvi8XYxCCpKsz?view=bVIhqvJfjdDl8TjJxAy-vd https://mytaskhelper.ru/widgets/aqVy9BlivjCQjdbMucQ1BN/dtype/btgxHAT0Tdz7XX1_v6--5w?view=bVIhqvJfjdDl8TjJxAy-vd https://mytaskhelper.ru/widgets/aqVy9BlivjCQjdbMucQ1BN/dtype/cPLKYPHQPphjLPKSpv5c0o?view=bVIhqvJfjdDl8TjJxAy-vd Here is the discussion link, if anyone interested: http://coins.su/forum/index.php?showtopic=27934&st=350&do=findComment&comment=1113126 I am still interested to know your heaviest weigh of this coin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobh Posted June 18, 2013 Report Share Posted June 18, 2013 I haven't read it all, but I have noticed they discussed the design varieties there after I analyzed the market and noticed 3 groups myself yesterday, so the discovery was still exiting for me. They didn't bring up the question of weight before though, and I am interested to know the heaviest weight of this type. The heaviest reported there now is 22.95 g, but it's in a different variant grouping. https://mytaskhelper.ru/widgets/aqVy9BlivjCQjdbMucQ1BN/dtype/dwtCM0Pq9lvi8XYxCCpKsz?view=bVIhqvJfjdDl8TjJxAy-vd https://mytaskhelper.ru/widgets/aqVy9BlivjCQjdbMucQ1BN/dtype/btgxHAT0Tdz7XX1_v6--5w?view=bVIhqvJfjdDl8TjJxAy-vd https://mytaskhelper.ru/widgets/aqVy9BlivjCQjdbMucQ1BN/dtype/cPLKYPHQPphjLPKSpv5c0o?view=bVIhqvJfjdDl8TjJxAy-vd Here is the discussion link, if anyone interested: http://coins.su/forum/index.php?showtopic=27934&st=350&do=findComment&comment=1113126 I am still interested to know your heaviest weigh of this coin. This is a fascinating discussion! The question which poses itself here is, if there is such a marked difference in weight between this very rare variety and the normal strikes, then why is there such a correlation? The only reason that I can think of at the moment is that there might have been a need for some heavier coins to act as "remedium" for certain batches, and that the mint workers needed some way of optical recognition of the heavier coins so that they would not have to repeatedly weigh them again and again. But if only some of these coins with narrow monogram were overweight, this theory wouldn't hold water, of course... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
extant4cell Posted June 18, 2013 Author Report Share Posted June 18, 2013 In 1797 only silver coins were made heavier, by design. The copper had a set number of coins to be made from the a quantity of copper. That hasn't changed for years. that means that if they weighted that number of coins and they were less in weight than the quantity of copper that should have been used to produce them, they had to compensate by taking out a few lighter coins and adding some heavier coins, and if it was over, the other way around. It was the first production year of these coins with the new weight, so the technology of making the right thickness or the copper line for cutting round pieces was far from perfect and the variation of weight was significant. Tolstoy must have found one of the heaviest coins he could find for his collection, and VKGM thought that this was the norm for this type, as that was the only coin he could have an easy access too. It would be interesting to find a coin that is as heavy as the one he printed in his catalog. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rsraghead Posted June 19, 2013 Report Share Posted June 19, 2013 Yes it would Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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