constanius

Knowledge is power and you are a very knowledgeable guy, good for you.

The one from Rouen is stunning, almost as struck, great find Clive The legend is shortened from the Latin SIT NOMEN DOMINI BENEDICTUM or in English, Blessed Be the Name of the Lord.

Very nice Ian, happy new year. The date is circa 476BC, I know it is just a typo. Obv. slow quadriga, horses crowned by Nike Rev. head Arethusa, 4 dolphins

Withers #15 34mm 18.7g grained edge ///// die axis 0 C #15a 34mm 19.0g grained edge ///// die axis 12 VC #15b 35mm 25.2g centre grained edge \\\\\ die axis 12 RRR S Whitchurch and W. Dore, engraver Peter Wyon Davis#74 Samuel T. Whitchurch; After voyaging around the world as a youth he joined the Royal Navy, saw active duty on Monmouth during the war of American Independence. He was in charge of signals on Grafton under captain Collingwood. On Alert he saw action against the Dutch off Dogger Bank in 1781. In 1782 he served under Collingwood again against the French in the West Indies, where he was severely wounded. Returning home to Bath he entered business as a ironmonger & brazier at number 3 Bridge Street and prospered. In 1796 he moved the business to 26 Market Place(now the High street) he died Christmas day 1817. William Dore; Was a hatter, hosier, mercer & draper of 24 Market Place & along with Whitchurch was a subscriber to the Union Bluecoat School to educate 30 boys from 7 to 14 in Christian principles. In 1809 he was one of the overseers for the parish of St. Peter & St. Paul. He sold his business in 1813 and retired to Weston near Bath where he erected a new school. Later he was a partner in the Bath City Bank(1815-22), later still the proprieter of the White Lion Hotel Market Place, Bath. In 1819 he became the High Constable of Bath.

Congratulations, nice to know its pedigree.

Received a reply back from the British Museum; "It looks to me like another engraver copying Kirk's design, ie not deceiving, just plagiarising. It certainly doesn't look later than early 19th century and could indeed be contemporary" Another possibility I can think of is perhaps an apprentice piece, "GB, have a go at copying that token of Granby by Kirk". I guess somethings are meant to remain a mystery but I will carry on checking all the sentimental tokens for 'variants'. EDIT 18.04.2014 I have since purchased another of these tokens signed GB, which is more worn, and just seen another in almost uncirculated condition which leads me to one last theory.... that these were produced for a Marquis of Granby Inn.

The year 1774 is just the second & last year that the tokens were issued as a gift with the magazine, the first tokens are dated for 1773, the only exceptions are Cromwell's dated 1658 & George II, Beckford & Duchess of Cumberland undated. Granby's token is considered to be the last token struck for the March 1774 issue of the magazine, the magazine itself was published till 1777. So the date is not significant re Granby per se. Perhaps as you suggest Bill there was a bigger demand for medals of Granby than the limited number issued with the magazine could satisfy & some enterprising fellow made some copies, not wanting to deceive he sign them GB, not KIRK FEC. Just strange in that I have kept close watch on all the sentimentals being offered for sale(ebay, dealers & auctions for 4 years) & never spotted another copy, but perhaps he only struck a few. General John Manners, Marquess of Granby PC, (Kelham, 2 January 1721 – October 18, 1770, Scarborough), British soldier, was the eldest son of the 3rd Duke of Rutland. As he did not outlive his father, he was known by his father's subsidiary title, Marquess of Granby. Minden was Granby's first great battle. At the head of the Blues he was one of the cavalry leaders halted at the critical moment by Lieutenant-General Sackville, and when in consequence that officer was sent home in disgrace, GRANBY succeeded to the command of the British contingent in Ferdinand's army, having 32,000 men under his orders at the beginning of 1760. He also replaced Sackville as Lieutenant-General of the Ordnance. During Sackville's court-martial, Granby testified that Sackville had led the cavalry forward too slowly. Although he suggested Sackville had not been negligent, he could not prevent a verdict of "guilty", and Sackville was thereafter embittered against him. In the remaining campaigns of the Seven Years' War the English contingent was more conspicuous by its conduct than the Prussians themselves. On July 31, 1760 Granby brilliantly stormed Warburg at the head of the British cavalry, capturing 1500 men and ten pieces of artillery. Since his twenties, he had been almost entirely bald, but disdained to wear a wig; during the charge, he lost his hat, giving rise to the expression "going at it bald-headed". A year later (July 15, 1761) the British defended the heights of Villinghausen with what Ferdinand himself styled "indescribable bravery". On the following day, he led his troops in a counter-attack and helped drive the French from the field. His opponent, the duc de Broglie, was so impressed that he commissioned a portrait of GRANBY by Sir Joshua Reynolds. In the last campaign, at Gravenstein and Wilhelmsthal, Homberg, Gudensberg and Cassel, Granby's men bore the brunt of the fighting and earned the greatest share of the glory. Lord Ligonier praised his conduct at Wilhelmsthal, where he cut off the French rearguard as "Il a manoeuvré comme un ange … no man ever acted with more courage or more like a commanding officer." His last field action was at Brückermühl, where he brought two brigades to the relief of General Zastrow. 486. MARQUIS OF GRANBY. 1759. Bust of the Marquis of Granby, r., hair short, in armour and riband across the breast. Leg. THE BRITISH HERO . THE MARQUIS OF GRANBY. Rev. A heart, crowned, within a wreath of laurel. 1759 Medal of John Manners 1721-1770. The Marquis of Granby. Hero of the Battle of Minden Aug. 1st 1759. Brass 27mm. MI 703/436. Rare. There are many pubs still named The Marquis of Granby. They were originally named so, partly due to his personal sponsorship of his disabled non-commissioned officers as publicans and also because of his public popularity as a war hero. He was also praised, not just by the british, but his enemies too for his heroism, one went so far as to commission a portrait of him. He lost his hair whilst young, but rather than wear a wig (fashionable at that time) he was proud of his baldness and even had his portraits painted with his pate bare, as he is portrayed on this medal.

Strange that I have never seen another copy of any other of the sentimentals, in fact it is a very rare occurence to see contemporary copies of this type of medal(19th century copies/galvano/electrotypes for museums yes), whereas some conder tokens(wilkinsons) were freely copied often, as they had a cash value, as were coins of the realm.

Thanks. A real puzzle, because if it was meant to deceive why not just sign it the same as Kirk's, if it had been I probably would not have spotted it! They have never been really worth enough to fake them, except Pitt, he is worth the most because of the US interest. The one signed GB I suspect is contemporary to the original. If it is a contemporary fake I am more than happy to include it in my collection. I will send the pics to the British Museum for their comments.

The Sentimental Token of the Marquis of Granby by John Kirk is 26mm and like the other 12 Sentimental Tokens is signed Kirk Fec. The other token is signed GB below the bust & is 25mm, it is a real mystery. I have never seen another token so similar to Kik's Sentimental tokens before, or one signed by anyone but Kirk. As to who is GB I will have to work on that one. I took another picture of Kirk's one & tried to show that it is even more similar than the original pictures suggest;

Nice portrait(for Kettle) & good detail, as to Brown, I suspect he did not always know his brass from his elbow

The reverse on this appears to be the same as on your #484 Vern(which matches the drawing in Hennin), but the obverse portrait and the spacing between FR. & ET is quite different. It is not in Hennin, so I assume it is just an unlisted variant of 484, as the only other one of the SOL REGNI ABIIT not having ROI or REX after XVI on the obverse is #485 & it does not have(according to Hennin) IETTON in the exergue, unless of course it is a mule of #485 obverse(not illustrated, just "similar to previous") & #484 reverse Any thoughts?

My newest addition, the top medal, has a plain edge. It joins the other 2, middle one straight engrailed edge, lower one diagonally engrailed edge. The new one is not signed Kettle below the bust, does that ring a bell? BHM#995; Obv. Similar to No. 994. Laureate head of George III, right. GOD PROTECTS THE JUST Rev. Name of Jehovah in Hebrew above rays shining down on Imperial crown. FEAR GOD HONOUR THE KING Br. 25 by T. Kettle. RRRR. Highest rarity in BHM, It looks like they used the unsigned die from 1810 again in 1820 for the unsiged death medal. Notice the distance from the 'C' to the bust, the unsigned medals have a smaller gap. Also the latest addition is copper(can see it peeking through in places, though it appears to have been gilded, Brown only listed this in brass, the 3rd one also looks more bronze or copper than brass. It is sometimes hard to tell for sure. Obv. Laureate head of George III, right. GOD PROTECTS THE JUST Rev. Inscription within rays G III / COMPLEATED / THE 50TH YEAR / OF HIS REIGN / OCTR. 25TH / 1810. 1810 BHM#682 25mm, AE C. AE silvered C. by Kettle & Sons. Oh, and there is no such thing as "too many" where medals are concerned, especially RRRR. ones

Wow, great condition.

Looks like one of Sweeney Todd's victims(he finished them off with a cut-throat razor) the obverse would look better rotated 90 degrees counter-clockwise so the blood flow is on the floor. I suspect I maybe watching too many forensic dramas on TV. Great deal & still a most attractive coin with character, somethings look better with age.

But the man portrayed is Benedikt Fontana, a Swiss national hero who died at the Battle of Calven in 1499 during the Swabian war, the "Frisch avf vnd dran(daran)" are his words(though wounded) extolling his men on to victory http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Calven It would be like putting William Tell or George Washington on the reverse, though like you I like the reverse

Is this guy(Stillhard) boasting or what! as the actress said to the bishop "thats what they all say". Great set of medals & beautiful photos but where are 'The ladies with big hats' Zohar? So many guns & if no guns crossbows, anyone would think these were really meant to be about shooting. hiho to the rescue, she is cute.....& not a gun or crossbow in sight.

BHM#1842 AE, WM 51mm C; AE, WM 46mm N; AE, WM 35mm N. by ? This example is WM(silvered)46mm. Obv. Diademed head of Queen Victoria left, hair in chignon: Above VICTORIA Around ASCENDED THE BRITISH THRONE JUNE 20. 1837. IN THE 19. YEAR OF HER AGE. Rev. Queen Victoria enthroned with right foot resting on the British lion; Commerce, Britannia, Justice and Plenty around. Above CORONATION In exergue: AT WESTMINSTER/JUNE 28th. 1838.

Apparently it was a great success. He was also the first monarch to pay a state visit to Ireland(1821) since Richard II of England.

Obv: Laureated head of George IV, left. GEORGE IV KING OF GREAT BRITAIN. Rev: A Scottish thistle, SCOTLAND EXULTS IN THE PRESENCE OF HER KING. BHM#1196 AE R. Br R. 26mm by ? 1822

British Historical Medals - 1134 - KING GEORGE IV: VISIT TO IRELAND Brass 25mm N. by ? I. Parkes Obv. Similar to No. 1133 Laureate head of George IV, left. GEORGIUS IV BRITANNIARUM REX F. D. Rev. Irish harp above sprays of shamrocks. Above: VISIT TO IRELAND Below: ERIN GO BRAGH / + . AUGUST 1821 + . Copying/Reducing lines clearly visible, I have seen strikes, from what appear to be the same die, after the lines have been polished out. Here is one My lhttp://maxentius.lamoneta.it/PagineMedaglie/VisitaGiorgioIVinIrlanda.htmink He was the first monarch to pay a state visit to Ireland since Richard II of England.

Wow, what a great collection Bill, my favourite one is in the first post but I like them all.

So true, they are stunning but therein lies the danger: From http://rg.ancients.info/replicas/; "The Czech replica maker Antiquanova also makes excellent ancient coin replicas, marking them unobtrusively on the reverse with an S countermark for Petr Sousek, the engraver" "Because Antiquanova replicas are easier to obtain than Slaveys, you see more copies of them, often sold as replicas by other replica makers who use them to cast other copies or sold as authentic coins by scammers who tool them to remove the countermark, create cast copies and tool the molds to remove the countermark, or create transfer dies and took the dies to remove the countermark"

I do not remember attacking Westair, so do not feel inclined to give them a break. The quote you used of mine was in regard to fantasy pattern coins. Though I did say I disliked copies because of the confusion they can cause & the potential for fraud. Well here is one buyer of a Westair copy who asked "is it a fake ?" which tends to prove my point.

Hi Drusus, nice full answer. I dislike these copies & the modern fantasy pattern coins because they can cause so much confusion & to me are a total waste of money. There is also the possibility that some unscrupulous cad will "doctor' them to make them look even more like genuine coins. Why someone would buy a newly struck fantasy piece(even if they are well struck, nice designs, perhaps from Cavendish Collectables) when for the same money you can buy a genuine coin or medal is beyond my comprehension. Many people must buy them though because they are churning them out in the thousands. I would like to find a genuine ancient roman aluminum coin!