nioc Posted May 26, 2008 Report Share Posted May 26, 2008 Good morning, there are some pictures of that coin: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nioc Posted May 26, 2008 Report Share Posted May 26, 2008 Good morning,there are some pictures of that coin: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nioc Posted May 26, 2008 Report Share Posted May 26, 2008 ...and another one... Possibly it is well done fake but it is interesting when it could be made. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobh Posted May 26, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 26, 2008 Thanks for the pictures ... they look very good! I'm a little suspicious of the edge lettering, though, which looks a little uneven. But it is hard to tell. Did you hold this coin next to a genuine coin to compare diameters, or did you measure it some other way? It is possible that this might be genuine, especially considering that the weight seems to be correct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nioc Posted May 27, 2008 Report Share Posted May 27, 2008 Thanks for the pictures ... they look very good! I'm a little suspicious of the edge lettering, though, which looks a little uneven. But it is hard to tell. Did you hold this coin next to a genuine coin to compare diameters, or did you measure it some other way? It is possible that this might be genuine, especially considering that the weight seems to be correct. Thanks for comments, bobh. I have measured this coin with a diameter measurer also compared to the next 2 same coins, it is in fact a little bigger (to be exact 0.25mm) than other ones. I still can't catch the mystery how this coin bigger in diameter efforts weight correctly? The first suspicion that alloy is possibly false and that's what I'll try to check now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmsaf Posted March 17, 2010 Report Share Posted March 17, 2010 Here's an extremely deceptive fake 10 rouble gold coin which I bought on eBay a few months ago. The dealer was honorable and gave me my money back; I'm sure he didn't have a clue. This one was a giveaway due to the wrong mintmaster -- Alexander Redko didn't start work at the St. Petersburg mint until 1901, thus it isn't possible that his initials would have been engraved on a coin of 1899. Besides, the coin weighed in at only 8.4 grams instead of 8.6. With silver coins, this might not be indication of a fake because often they were weighed in bulk at the mint, and tolerance was about 0.18 plus or minus for silver roubles weighing 20 grams or more. But gold coins only had a tolerance of 1/10 gram or so, and they were weighed inidividually (information from Uzdenikov). Moral of the story is: KNOW YOUR COINS! Here's a picture of the coin (obverse, reverse and edge): Thank god I read your article last week. Guess what? I too purchased two coins from a dealer in Washington DC and received the same type of coin. dated 1899 with AP as the mint master. the diameter is exactly 0.005" larger than my other rubles. diameter size measures 0.895". The thickness also measures slightly larger 0.064" opposed to a standard of .061". I am now trying to get my money back. Also, don't know if the second coin received from him is also a fake. it is a 10 rouble 1904 with the mintmaster AP. It looks real but who knows. Not all that is gold glitters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobh Posted March 17, 2010 Author Report Share Posted March 17, 2010 Thank god I read your article last week. Guess what? I too purchased two coins from a dealer in Washington DC and received the same type of coin. dated 1899 with AP as the mint master. the diameter is exactly 0.005" larger than my other rubles. diameter size measures 0.895". The thickness also measures slightly larger 0.064" opposed to a standard of .061". I am now trying to get my money back. Also, don't know if the second coin received from him is also a fake. it is a 10 rouble 1904 with the mintmaster AP. It looks real but who knows. Not all that is gold glitters. Make sure that the mintmaster is really (A.P) and not (А.Г) -- i.e. Cyrillic letters AG for Apollon Grasgov who was mintmaster for some of the 1899 coins. Alexander Redko, or AP with Cyrillic initials, worked at the mint only from 1901-1904(?) and is therefore not permissible on coins dating 1899. I'm not sure whether the measurements you have fall within the tolerance for these coins. Weight is usually what gives away a fake; if the weight is correct, I think you would see much greater variation in thickness, etc. Does the 1899 coin weigh 8.4 grams? There are other types of fakes which have varying weights ... the one in the message starting the topic is the cleverest I have seen, though ... the others you can usually spot a mile away because of the bad design. The mintmaster initials (A.P) are correct for 1904. If the 1904 ten rouble coin weighs the correct amount (8.6 grams) and the design is OK, it is probably genuine. Post some pictures here if you can, please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rupla Posted April 5, 2010 Report Share Posted April 5, 2010 I have 10 rouble 1903 and 7,5 rouble 1897.Both are little over weight,10 rouble is 8,63g and 7,5 rouble is 6,47g is that ok??? both coins look real to me and local coindealer says at these are real I dont have pictures sorry my bad english Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobh Posted April 10, 2010 Author Report Share Posted April 10, 2010 I have 10 rouble 1903 and 7,5 rouble 1897.Both are little over weight,10 rouble is 8,63g and 7,5 rouble is 6,47g is that ok??? both coins look real to me and local coindealer says at these are real I dont have pictures sorry my bad english The weight is OK. I believe there was something like 0.05g +/- tolerance for 10 rouble gold coins (the "remedium"). Uzdenikov wrote about it in his book "Monety Rossii" (2nd edition 1992). For some reason, most of the fake 10 rouble coins I have seen are 1899. Once there was an attempt on eBay to sell a 1908 ten rouble coin (that year doesn't exist!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maya Posted April 10, 2010 Report Share Posted April 10, 2010 The weight is OK. I believe there was something like 0.05g +/- tolerance for 10 rouble gold coins (the "remedium"). Uzdenikov wrote about it in his book "Monety Rossii" (2nd edition 1992). Once there was an attempt on eBay to sell a 1908 ten rouble coin (that year doesn't exist!) I remember that coin. If my memory serves me correctly, it looked very impressive ... if one didn't know any better. Good to see you back, Bobh. Hope you are feeling well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobh Posted April 10, 2010 Author Report Share Posted April 10, 2010 I remember that coin. If my memory serves me correctly, it looked very impressive ... if one didn't know any better. Most fakes usually do ... after all, the counterfeiters want to sell them for as much money as they can! Sometimes, though, with very rare dates, fake coins are artificially "aged" to make them look more genuine. This was the one supposedly stuck inside the binding of an old Bible, wasn"t it? Good to see you back, Bobh. Hope you are feeling well. Thank you ... everything went very well, and I was able to come home this morning (still somewhat tired, though). Had to have a small section of my large intestine removed due to diverticulosis. But it is a much easier operation today than it was 20 years ago, when my Mom had to have it done ... today, everything is done with laparoscopy and computer monitors. They operated on Tuesday, and I am home on Saturday already. It's really hard to believe! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexbq2 Posted April 10, 2010 Report Share Posted April 10, 2010 Glad to hear everything went well! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
altyn Posted April 10, 2010 Report Share Posted April 10, 2010 I am glad to hear you are doing well Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hanulek1 Posted November 14, 2010 Report Share Posted November 14, 2010 Hi I am new to your site. My mother showed me her 10 roubles from 1899 and after reading your post I am sure that it it a fake. Her concers are that the coin is very coppery looking on the eagle side. The face is gold colour I can't find enywhere informations about two different colours. Can you help? I have checked and it seems to have AP on its rim! Everything points out that it is a fake and she will be really upset because she invested in it as a security for her old age. She is 80 years of age and she doesnt have a lot of miney to wast. Is this fake worth anything at all? Your advice would be welcome. Thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
one-kuna Posted November 14, 2010 Report Share Posted November 14, 2010 Hi I am new to your site. My mother showed me her 10 roubles from 1899 and after reading your post I am sure that it it a fake. Her concers are that the coin is very copper on the eagle side. I have checed and it seems to have AP on its rim! Everything points out that it is a fake and she will be really upset because she invested in it as a security for her old age. She is 80 years of age and she doesnt have a lot of miney to wast. Is this fake worth anything at all? Your advice would be welcome. Thank you. can you scan or photograph this coin both sides please Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hanulek1 Posted November 14, 2010 Report Share Posted November 14, 2010 Sorry I dont have a scanner. The coin looks like the photos showed in one of the post above. Only the eagle side looks coppery. It has AP and and my husband just weighed it and the weight is 7.6g! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
one-kuna Posted November 14, 2010 Report Share Posted November 14, 2010 Sorry I dont have a scanner. The coin looks like the photos showed in one of the post above. Only the eagle side looks coppery. It has AP and and my husband just weighed it and the weight is 7.6g! then, I cannot tell what you have; referencing to the picture above does not guarantee you to get the right answer; may be some of your friends or nearest library around can help you with the picture; if not a secretr where are you located Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobh Posted November 14, 2010 Author Report Share Posted November 14, 2010 Sorry I dont have a scanner. The coin looks like the photos showed in one of the post above. Only the eagle side looks coppery. It has AP and and my husband just weighed it and the weight is 7.6g! Everything you have mentioned about this object so far indicates that it is not genuine. The weight should be 8.6 grams, not 7.6 grams which is way too low. The difference in weight allowed by the Russian Imperial mint was more like 0.04 grams (+/-) for these gold coins. I hope that your mother is able to get her money back, if this is a recent purchase. If purchased before 2004 when the price of gold took off, she would only be out about $100 or so -- today, these sell for about $350 (if genuine, that is). Hardly enough to retire on, I must say. But it is always painful to discover that one has spent good money on a fake, and I am sorry for your Mom! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
one-kuna Posted November 14, 2010 Report Share Posted November 14, 2010 there can be a hope that a weight is incorrect done by your husband, it is hard to believe that you cannot provide a picture, try do so as I mentioned in earlier post Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hanulek1 Posted November 14, 2010 Report Share Posted November 14, 2010 Ii is only 7,6 g for sure and the eagle side is a cooper colour. I tried to upload the pictures but they were too big!. Is it possible that it was forged in 1960 by Beirut forgers?Thank you for your help Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobh Posted November 14, 2010 Author Report Share Posted November 14, 2010 Ii is only 7,6 g for sure and the eagle side is a cooper colour. I tried to upload the pictures but they were too big!. Is it possible that it was forged in 1960 by Beirut forgers?Thank you for your help If you send me a personal message, I will give you an email address where you can send me the pictures. Then I will upload them to my own server and put links to them here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hanulek1 Posted November 14, 2010 Report Share Posted November 14, 2010 there can be a hope that a weight is incorrect done by your husband, it is hard to believe that you cannot provide a picture, try do so as I mentioned in earlier post Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
one-kuna Posted November 14, 2010 Report Share Posted November 14, 2010 do as bobh said Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
z32tt Posted January 10, 2011 Report Share Posted January 10, 2011 Hi all, I have an 1899 10 rouble gold coin with the initials (э б) I weighed it on a scale that reads to 0.1g accuracy and it came out to 8.6g Is this authentic? I've only been reading about A.P and aг Here are some pictures(my camera skills are atrocious): Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexbq2 Posted January 10, 2011 Report Share Posted January 10, 2011 (э б) initials are valid for 1899. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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