1913D Barber $1/2

[Ian]

A very high grade Denver coin, with all letters in `Liberty' pristine and barely a blemish on the whole coin......exceoting for the very dark toning. Obverse is a dark gun metal grey with gold / honey highlights but the surface is a bit matt in places. The reverse is a beautiful pandora's box of colours like a translucent shimmering oil slick on the surface. Unfortunately the scan doesn't show this .

 

Comments anyone?

 

[Art]

It's a beauty. The toning on certain coins is truly mysterious. I think much of it has to do with the preparation the plancett received before striking. I always wonder though, why one side will tone so radically and the other not. Perhaps that's where environmental situations come to bear.

[kryptonitecomics]

Looks like environmental damage to me? Very dark like it was toned on purpose to hide something? Keep in mind this is just impressions from your images which you say don't fully represent the coin so in hand I could have a completely different assessment.

[LostDutchman]

that could be environmental damage.. but I have also seen dark toning like that come from a coin that was dipped and then not washed off....

[Ian]

Looks like environmental damage to me? Very dark like it was toned on purpose to hide something? Keep in mind this is just impressions from your images which you say don't fully represent the coin so in hand I could have a completely different assessment. 

 

No need to be coy. I invited your comments and I appreciate your saying what your impressions are, warts and all.

 

I had to boost the brightness and contrast to get the coin to show up in the first place, so although the scan is a fairly good representation of the coin `in hand', the colouration just isn't right. As with all scanners (but particularly my cheapo) you lose any consideration of `depth of field', in that what is crystla clear and sharp to the eye is just out of focus blur on a scan. These images remind me of using filters in photography to do `soft' shots (warm and fuzzy appearance)

 

It helps getting different perspectives and indeed you may very well be right in your assessment. My small but none the less niggling concerns lie around the matt look to parts of the obverse. It might be that the coin was once scuffed or cleaned and the toning is covering that. I'm just not sure but it looks like old toning to me. I'm completely suspicion free concerning the reverse. OK it's darkish but it looks 100% genuine. That having been said, I guess any form of `toning' can be viewed as environmental damage dependent upon your take on it.

 

You will understand my reluctance to do anything to remove the toning to see if there's any underlying problems. There's nothing obviously wrong to the nekkid eye or when using a x5 so if the toning is hiding something, its working well. I only wish my scanner could show the true colouration.

[LostDutchman]

on the other side apart from being damage....i have also seen that color from storage in leather purses...

[elverno]

It looks like a real beauty. I've got a couple of Louis XVIII jetons that are darkly toned on the obverse and nearly blast white on the reverse. I know that both of them were stored face up in a mahogany coin cabinet. Perhaps something similar has happened here, except that it might have been stored in a tissue or something that provided the toning.

[Mark Stilson]

Real nice shape especially for a Barber head.

[Dan769]

I like Barbers. Nice condition, wear wise. Send it in for "conservation"

[Ian]

I can see it now `Wee Jock's Coin Conservation Services' above a picture of a kilted numismatist weilding his trusty dremel and pot scourer. That's about the strength of any `conserving' services over here on my side of the pond.

 

While i'm sure `Wee Jock' is probably more than up to the task of removing the toning, i'd rather not trouble him at this point in time.

 

Sending it over to the US just to have NGC's sister company dip it slightly doesn't seem right to me. Maybe some day I might take up your suggestion though.

[bustchaser]

I can see it now `Wee Jock's Coin Conservation Services' above a picture of a kilted numismatist weilding his trusty dremel and pot scourer. That's about the strength of any `conserving' services over here on my side of the pond.

 

While i'm sure `Wee Jock' is probably more than up to the task of removing the toning, i'd rather not trouble him at this point in time. 

 

Sending it over to the US  just to have NGC's sister company dip it slightly doesn't seem right to me. Maybe some day I might take up your suggestion though. 

 

 

Puleeeeze don't. I like it. Silver coins this age SHOULD NOT BE WHITE!!!!!!

[Dan769]

I know its a scan, but where is the mint mark? And where do you obtain this piece?

[Ian]

I know its a scan, but where is the mint mark? And where do you obtain this piece?

 

 

1. Between the eagles tail and the `D' in dollar. It's discernable in the scan, just not as sharp as it is when viewed `in the hand'. The coin is definitely genuine though.

 

2. From a seller based in France.

[Ian]

It looks like a real beauty. I've got a couple of Louis XVIII jetons that are darkly toned on the obverse and nearly blast white on the reverse. I know that both of them were stored face up in a mahogany coin cabinet. Perhaps something similar has happened here, except that it might have been stored in a tissue or something that provided the toning.

 

This one came from a source in France that I buy a lot of jetons from, many of which are dark toned.....usually on one side only, although I have had a couple that are dark both sides. This one looks like it might have been kept for decades in the old brown sulphur rich envelope it arrived with.

[Sir Sisu]

I like it. Though it is not my preferred shade of greyish toning, I prefer them fairly even and uniform as yours appears to be. And if the toning is hiding something underneath, then so much the better!

[GDJMSP]

I only wish my scanner could show the true colouration.

 

 

Remove a thin piece of glass from a framed photo you have in the house - almost everyone has at least one. Clean it - then sit something, anything really, approx 1/4 thick on your scanner bed and lay one end of the glass on top of it so the glass sits at an angle to the scanner bed. Place the coin on the glass and scan away.

 

This method always works for me. It allows you to capture luster & color with a scanner that equals the best digital cameras

[Ian]

Remove a thin piece of glass from a framed photo you have in the house - almost everyone has at least one. Clean it - then sit something, anything really, approx 1/4 thick on your scanner bed and lay one end of the glass on top of it so the glass sits at an angle to the scanner bed. Place the coin on the glass and scan away.

 

This method always works for me. It allows you to capture luster & color with a scanner that equals the best digital cameras 

 

 

well.....that sounded a pretty good tip there, but I guess at the end of the day I maybe should have invested a bit more in my scanner than I did.

 

It's a flat bed scanner, and needless to say i've just tried your suggestion........but (typically of my luck) my results so far are just blurred images with little improvement to the colouration achieved. I must be doing something wrong.

 

Here's the best one so far. A slight improvement in colour gain but at a price in terms of being able to identify what it actually is.

 

Looks to me as if there's possibly some mileage to be gained from experimenting a little with angles of incidence and position of the coin on the glass etcetera, but definitely a job for the weekend.

 

[Ian]

Here's a couple of shots wid me trusty kodak brownie (olympus D100). Even in `macro' mode it's keerapppp for taking photo's of coins. However it does give a hint as to what I was saying about the colouration on the reverse. It mainly just looks like dark honey brown .....until tilted. The obverse is mainly dark honey colours 9tilted or otherwise).

 

[bill]

Wow, your last shots create an entirely different impression of the coin. I don't know your scanner or software, but if you have the ability to do a pre-scan, set adjustments for brightness, contrast, and color balance before your do the final scan, I would guess you should be able to get better results. Think about how the scanner light bar moves across the coin. Sometimes rotating the coin so the light hits it differently will improve the scan. In the end, you may need an external light set up to do justice to the coin. I would shy away from any cleaning based on the last set of pictures. The toning does not appear to me to be that unattractive and probably nicer in hand than in the picture. The toning does appear to be intense enough (alas, I know nothing of metalurgy so my opinion means little) that any attempt to remove it would damage the coin more than it has been damaged by the toning. The reverse appears to be quite attractive and if the obverse actually looks like that as well, I'd say its a damned fine coin.

[Tiffibunny]

Now that is some nice toning.

[Ian]

Wow, your last shots create an entirely different impression of the coin. I don't know your scanner or software, but if you have the ability to do a pre-scan, set adjustments for brightness, contrast, and color balance before your do the final scan, I would guess you should be able to get better results. Think about how the scanner light bar moves across the coin. Sometimes rotating the coin so the light hits it differently will improve the scan. In the end, you may need an external light set up to do justice to the coin. I would shy away from any cleaning based on the last set of pictures. The toning does not appear to me to be that unattractive and probably nicer in hand than in the picture. The toning does appear to be intense enough (alas, I know nothing of metalurgy so my opinion means little) that any attempt to remove it would damage the coin more than it has been damaged by the toning. The reverse appears to be quite attractive and if the obverse actually looks like that as well, I'd say its a damned fine coin.

 

Face on, the coin does look fairly bland. tilted ever so slightly and you get the results seen in the photo.

 

There are some things I am good at, there are some things I am lousy at. I'm a better collector than I am a photographer (at least I would sincerely hope so! )

 

While I feel justified in blaming the poor results on the (crap) scanner I also appreciate that my skills in scanning could probably be improved exponentially. I am reconciled to the need for upgrading both (and spending some money in the process )

[bill]

There are some things I am good at, there are some things I am lousy at. I'm a better collector than I am a photographer (at least I would sincerely hope so! )

 

I have an issue or two with your skills as a collector. As a result of your skilled postings, I sent off a query as to the availability of a French jetton on the cgb website. If its still available, I'm placing the blame squarely on your shoulders for my purchase. If I can't stop at just one, you know who I'll blame.

[GDJMSP]

Looks to me as if there's possibly some mileage to be gained from experimenting a little with angles of incidence and position of the coin on the glass etcetera, but definitely a job for the weekend.

 

 

 

Must admit I'm surprised as I've had pretty good luck with the trick. Here's an example. The first is the coin scanned flat on the bed. The second is the very same coin with one edge 1/4" above the scanner bed.

 

[GDJMSP]

Now then, that's when I was just playing around when I came up with the idea. But I think it illustrates the possibilities.

[Ian]

Now then, that's when I was just playing around when I came up with the idea. But I think it illustrates the possibilities.

 

Doug, to be perfectly honest i'd be happy just getting a result like your first scan, let alone the enhancements achieved in shot number two. I'll be trying again over the next 48 hrs but I think that i've got myself a pretty duff scanner that's simply not up to the task.