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Siberian copper money


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59 minutes ago, alexbq2 said:

Ian, to clarify - the 2K, 5K, and 1768 10K are, sadly, not genuine. The reason why we see them as not genuine is inextricably linked to the information provided in the links we shared. Namely, the lettering and design details on these coins are not consistent with that of the coins that are considered to be genuine. To put it in plain words, they don't look right.

You can see it for yourself if you compare the images of those 3 coins with the images of the genuine ones. While the overall design looks close, the devil is in the details.

OK. There is no `sadness' on my part in relation to the coins in question. it would be absolutely brilliant if they were genuine, but no significant financial loss if they are not. I've knowingly paid more for counterfeits than i did for these. The 10 kopecs cost the most though. The seller is a coin dealer in Portugal and they were selling it as a `novodel'. That most certainly it isn't, but I had thought it may very well be a normal circulation strike. It has remarkable similarity to coins authenticated and certified by PCGS that I have seen.....but then again memory is a very fickle thing at my age :)

As  I do not intend enlarging upon my Russian coin collection any time soon, especially given that I would be unable to assess coins `in the flesh',  I have to be proportionate with my studies in relation to my collecting intentions.  I will indeed have a look at the sites mentioned but suspect (unless I spend some numerous hours looking) I will be little the wiser at the end of it. There are probably as many (if not more) different dies used in striking these large lumps of copper as there were for copper coinage in my part of the world during that era, and as such I would still be left relatively ignorant as to whether small differences were due to die variety or other. 

What is your opinion of the 1778 5 kopecs and the 1770 10 kopecs by the way?

 

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1 hour ago, sigistenz said:

Hi Ian, this is a matter of long experience. I have been specializing in old Russian coins for nearly 5ü years. There are many features. Take for one the letters indicating value and date. I do not succeed inserting links here, don't know why. Do copy it in your browser. It shows pictures of genuine coins auctioned in Russia. Compare and get an idea. Sleeping time for little boys  here - Good Night 

https://www.m-dv.ru/monety-rossii-1700-1917/kid,14/mid,18/nid,36/types.html

Thanks again Sigi. I'll take a look at your website and the one above at some point tomorrow. Shut eye time here too:)

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9 hours ago, alexbq2 said:

1778 5K looks alright to me. 1770 10K is a bit rough, I'm not sure about it.

As a general rule can be said that modern fakes are never that worn because they have not seen any circulation. Judging from the pictures  the worn coins shown here are genuine. Seeing the edge however would give even more certainty. 

Sigi

 

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  • 2 weeks later...

I think we were all looking at that 1768 10k from Portugal - it would have been one of the nicer examples in existence if it was legit, worth a lot more - but it has the painted patina look, the dies don't look right, the light metal look under the cipher 

you should SNAD that one if seller doesn't allow a return

his other novodels are modern bunk too

there's not much of a shortcut to figuring these things out, those of us who can look at something and say it doesn't look right spent decades compulsively checking the catalogs against what's being offered for sale 

if you stacked all of SIgi's discarded pitaki, it would form a column that would reach Jupiter

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On 2/15/2021 at 7:30 AM, underbidder said:

if you stacked all of SIgi's discarded pitaki, it would form a column that would reach Jupiter

Not quite,but over the years I upgraded many of them several times and still do...

Sigi

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