Rhino Posted October 22, 2010 Report Share Posted October 22, 2010 Hey, I just got this one in the mail and the edge is making me worried... 1895 AG 50 Kopek. Notice how the Russian words "чистаго" and "серебра" are so close together? Looking for an opinion on whether this is normal for this year and mintmark or if I have a fake Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobh Posted October 22, 2010 Report Share Posted October 22, 2010 Hey, I just got this one in the mail and the edge is making me worried... 1895 AG 50 Kopek. Notice how the Russian words "чистаго" and "серебра" are so close together? Looking for an opinion on whether this is normal for this year and mintmark or if I have a fake Thanks Did you weigh the coin? Check the diameter? My 1895 poltina is in an older NGC slab, so unfortunately I can't see the edge. But everything else about your coin looks good: portrait, rim border thickness and reverse design are all as they should be. Although 1895 is a somewhat scarce year, it isn't really rare enough to warrant making fakes of it IMHO. Most of the Chinese fakes I have seen were done with years 1900 and thereafter (possibly because they didn't want to make so many different dies?) And most of those are pretty bad because they used the same portrait and the 1912 and later reverse even for earlier years. Now if it were 1898, I would be worried! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
one-kuna Posted October 22, 2010 Report Share Posted October 22, 2010 Hey, I just got this one in the mail and the edge is making me worried... 1895 AG 50 Kopek. Notice how the Russian words "чистаго" and "серебра" are so close together? Looking for an opinion on whether this is normal for this year and mintmark or if I have a fake Thanks besides your question, oh man, there are so many better condition poltinas than this one, why would one buy such bad coin... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhino Posted October 23, 2010 Author Report Share Posted October 23, 2010 besides your question, oh man, there are so many better condition poltinas than this one, why would one buy such bad coin... Thanks for the opinion bobh! I appreciate the input. One kuna, the reason why someone would buy this "bad" coin is because I'm a poor college student who doesn't have a lot of money to spend on Russian coins that cost more than about $50. BUT, at the same time even though I have a low budget, I still want to collect because it is my hobby. So this is how I got this poltina: Bought a small lot of Russian silver - sold all the coins EXCEPT this 1895 poltina online and still made about $25 profit and kept a free coin. Yes, it's practically nothing to most people, and my coin may be judged as "ugly" but I'm still collecting and growing without putting my textbook/college/gas/food money into coins. I can't afford that now, so I have to get creative. I wish I could afford an UNC or proof, or a slabbed coin, or a rare mintmark or year, but I can't financially AND my only source of coins is ebay (no coin shops or clubs near me, nothing.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhino Posted October 23, 2010 Author Report Share Posted October 23, 2010 I will weight it tomorrow. What is the weight tolerance that the Russian mints allowed? I mean should the weight be exact, or can it be +/- a certain percent? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexbq2 Posted October 23, 2010 Report Share Posted October 23, 2010 IMHO the coin is alright. And it's looks are above average. I mean we see a lot of these poltinas from 1912 and 1913 in XF and above, so from type perspective one can easily snatch up something there. But for the early ones, especially if you are interested in 1895 the overwhelming majority are F and below. Getting anything near AUNC is not terribly affordable. I don't recall such strive for perfection in the 90-s. I think that's because everyone was using Uzdenikov's book, and that one only had rarity indicators, no emphasis on grade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobh Posted October 23, 2010 Report Share Posted October 23, 2010 I will weight it tomorrow. What is the weight tolerance that the Russian mints allowed? I mean should the weight be exact, or can it be +/- a certain percent? Uzdenikov and Adrianov both write about the so-called "remedium" or allowed leeway in weight -- I would have to look it up to be exact, but I believe it was less than 0.05 grams for coins of this type. They were pretty strict with gold and silver coins, but copper coins were weighed in batches which allowed for greater deviation of weight among individual coins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterShell Posted October 23, 2010 Report Share Posted October 23, 2010 Coin is OK.. mean if we talk about genuity. So don't worry. By the way there is nothing special in imperfections in the edge of the coin from this period. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhino Posted October 24, 2010 Author Report Share Posted October 24, 2010 Weight is 9.917g. Which I'm guessing is within range of normal since I decided to weigh my other poltinas as well, and I got 10.013g, 9.976g, and 9.942g for others. They're all within 1% of the actual book weight, which I'm thinking would be hard to fake. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobh Posted October 24, 2010 Report Share Posted October 24, 2010 Weight is 9.917g. Which I'm guessing is within range of normal since I decided to weigh my other poltinas as well, and I got 10.013g, 9.976g, and 9.942g for others. They're all within 1% of the actual book weight, which I'm thinking would be hard to fake. I think this weight is OK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grivna1726 Posted October 24, 2010 Report Share Posted October 24, 2010 Thanks for the opinion bobh! I appreciate the input. ....the reason why someone would buy this "bad" coin is because I'm a poor college student who doesn't have a lot of money to spend on Russian coins that cost more than about $50. BUT, at the same time even though I have a low budget, I still want to collect because it is my hobby. So this is how I got this poltina: Bought a small lot of Russian silver - sold all the coins EXCEPT this 1895 poltina online and still made about $25 profit and kept a free coin. Yes, it's practically nothing to most people, and my coin may be judged as "ugly" but I'm still collecting and growing without putting my textbook/college/gas/food money into coins. I can't afford that now, so I have to get creative... That seems like an eminently sensible approach to me. Much can be accomplished by a patient, attentive and observant collector of limited means. Congratulations on your latest acquisition and particularly on your intelligent approach to collecting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhino Posted October 24, 2010 Author Report Share Posted October 24, 2010 That seems like an eminently sensible approach to me. Much can be accomplished by a patient, attentive and observant collector of limited means. Congratulations on your latest acquisition and particularly on your intelligent approach to collecting. Thanks for the kind words Anyone know what the acceptable weight range is for Rouble coins? I just decided to weigh my Rouble coins from 1896, 1898, and 1900, and I got weights of 19.638, 19.528, and 19.774g. Which are all less than 3% away from the book weight (20g). It seems close enough, but I'm just wondering where I can find information about how accurate the mint was? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobh Posted October 24, 2010 Report Share Posted October 24, 2010 Thanks for the kind words Anyone know what the acceptable weight range is for Rouble coins? I just decided to weigh my Rouble coins from 1896, 1898, and 1900, and I got weights of 19.638, 19.528, and 19.774g. Which are all less than 3% away from the book weight (20g). It seems close enough, but I'm just wondering where I can find information about how accurate the mint was? It sounds like it is time for you to buy the excellent reference work by V.V. Uzdenikov -- he treats this subject (p. 546/547 of the 2nd edition, publ. 1992) and so many others in detail. There he says: "To the middle of the XIX century the remedium for silver coins was essentially reduced. It was expressed by the following figures: For single coins weighed separately: for a rouble with a normal weight of 20.73 grams: 0.18 g; [...]" Roubles of Nicholas II weighed only 20 grams, but the remedium would still be about the same, so I think your roubles' weights are within the permissible range. Also, according to Uzdenikov, genuine coins are sometimes found which exceed the "remedium" slightly in one direction or another because although individual coins were weighed, sometimes only spot checking was applied to a batch and such over- or underweight coins would have been missed quite often as a result. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhino Posted October 24, 2010 Author Report Share Posted October 24, 2010 It sounds like it is time for you to buy the excellent reference work by V.V. Uzdenikov -- he treats this subject (p. 546/547 of the 2nd edition, publ. 1992) and so many others in detail. There he says: "To the middle of the XIX century the remedium for silver coins was essentially reduced. It was expressed by the following figures: For single coins weighed separately: for a rouble with a normal weight of 20.73 grams: 0.18 g; [...]" Roubles of Nicholas II weighed only 20 grams, but the remedium would still be about the same, so I think your roubles' weights are within the permissible range. Also, according to Uzdenikov, genuine coins are sometimes found which exceed the "remedium" slightly in one direction or another because although individual coins were weighed, sometimes only spot checking was applied to a batch and such over- or underweight coins would have been missed quite often as a result. Thanks for the reference - books are one thing that I have no problems getting. I have Bitkin and Konros, I will definitely add Uzdenikov to the set and read up on that type of info. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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