Bronze 15 kopek! 1912 Probl Probe strike?

[Blackdrone]

Hello!

 

I never seen this before. What is this? Now i can buy it. It's price 400$. What is this coin's realized price?

 

THIS IS BRONZE, NOT SILVER!!!!

 

Weight is 3 gramms.

 

 

[one-kuna]

Hello!

 

I never seen this before. What is this? Now i can buy it. It's price 400$. What is this coin's realized price?

 

THIS IS COPPER, NOT SILVER!!!!

 

Weight is 3 gramms.

 

 

who said that it is from copper? your coin costs $1.00 may be $2.00

[STEVE MOULDING]

Hello!

 

I never seen this before. What is this? Now i can buy it. It's price 400$. What is this coin's realized price?

 

THIS IS COPPER, NOT SILVER!!!!

 

Weight is 3 gramms.

 

3g sounds like silver to me.

[Blackdrone]

who said that it is from copper? your coin costs $1.00 may be $2.00

 

No!

 

I have 3-4 1912 15 kopeks.

 

But it's special. It's not silver.

 

The weight is too much!

[STEVE MOULDING]

Blackdrone:

 

Regarding these 'lucky' chances that you keep getting to buy what is supposedly be an extremely rare coin for hundreds of dollars (instead of thousands), when the coin is usually junk.....

 

I strongly recommend BKB's advice

 

http://www.coinpeople.com/index.php?s=&amp...st&p=486421

 

Steve

[Blackdrone]

Blackdrone:

 

Regarding these 'lucky' chances that you keep getting to buy what is supposedly be an extremely rare coin for hundreds of dollars (instead of thousands), when the coin is usually junk.....

 

I strongly recommend BKB's advice

 

http://www.coinpeople.com/index.php?s=&amp...st&p=486421

 

Steve

 

 

I agree.

 

But as the explanation for that? Weight is 3 gramms.

 

I have 30 15 kopeks, but all 2,5-2,7 gramms.

 

P.S: Why i can't get lucky buy sometimes from a man who not imagine what is it worth?

[STEVE MOULDING]

I agree.

 

But as the explanation for that? Weight is 3 gramms.

 

I have 30 15 kopeks, but all 2,5-2,7 gramms.

 

P.S: Why i can't get lucky buy sometimes from a man who not imagine what is it worth?

 

Do some math....if a Silver 15K weighs 2.7g, what should a 15K copper version weigh? More? Less?

[Blackdrone]

Do some math....if a Silver 15K weighs 2.7g, what should a 15K copper version weigh? More? Less?

 

If i know, i wouldn't write forums.

 

See the new pictures, i have changed.

 

You can tell anything about this coin?

 

Or it's average?

[Rhino]

Assuming that the volume of both coins is the same, the copper coin should actually weigh less than the silver one. Copper's density is about 80% of silver, so if you ignore the volume differences of the coins and use the 3g mass to figure out the density of the mystery coin, you'll end up with a density too far from the real density of copper.

 

As for the picture - to me it looks like a regular 15 kopek with a lot of crap on it, all that black residue which I don't really want to call "patina", it's just got a lot of that stuff on it (might account for the extra 300 milligrams of mass?)

 

I have a few 15 Kopek coins in my collection, and I never spent more than $2-3 on any of them. If you spend $400 on this, I think you will be overpaying by $398. If you want to spend that kind of money, buy something you are very familiar with.

[STEVE MOULDING]

If i know, i wouldn't write forums.

 

Or, you could spend two minutes with google and actually try and think what a copper version should weigh.

But maybe you don't have time as you only have a short chance to buy this for $400

 

I don't have anything else to say.

[Blackdrone]

Or, you could spend two minutes with google and actually try and think what a copper version should weigh.

But maybe you don't have time as you only have a short chance to buy this for $400

 

I don't have anything else to say.

 

Reviews from the past my Anna poltina, said it's crap, and then turned out to be a rare version, and nice coin. And there I was lucky.

[Rhino]

I just did the math for you, and a copper coin of a 15 Kopek should weigh AT LEAST 450 milligrams LESS than the silver coin, assuming constant volume meaning same die same blanks.

 

If your mystery coin has the same diameter and same thickness as the silver coin, then you now have 2 silver coins and the extra mass is from the residue then, in my opinion.

[Blackdrone]

Assuming that the volume of both coins is the same, the copper coin should actually weigh less than the silver one. Copper's density is about 80% of silver, so if you ignore the volume differences of the coins and use the 3g mass to figure out the density of the mystery coin, you'll end up with a density too far from the real density of copper.

 

As for the picture - to me it looks like a regular 15 kopek with a lot of crap on it, all that black residue which I don't really want to call "patina", it's just got a lot of that stuff on it (might account for the extra 300 milligrams of mass?)

 

I have a few 15 Kopek coins in my collection, and I never spent more than $2-3 on any of them. If you spend $400 on this, I think you will be overpaying by $398. If you want to spend that kind of money, buy something you are very familiar with.

 

Sorry for my english, but it's coin is bronze!! Not copper! Or It's same?

[Rhino]

Sorry for my english, but it's coin is bronze!! Not copper! Or It's same?

 

before spending $400, make sure you know what any coin is made of, or you might end up buying pewter or something that's not worth a penny.

 

Bronze is an alloy, so it's mostly copper but they throw in stuff like tin or aluminum into it, too. IF YOUR COIN HAS COPPER + TIN OR ALUMINUM IN IT, IT SHOULD WEIGH EVEN LESS THAN A PURE COPPER COIN. Density of aluminum is 20% of silver, and density of tin is 70% of silver, so the weight difference would be even more drastic.

 

At this point, save your money and forget about it. It's physically impossible to have a copper coin and a silver coin be the same volume and have the copper coin weight more. Math and chemistry will show you.

[Blackdrone]

before spending $400, make sure you know what any coin is made of, or you might end up buying pewter or something that's not worth a penny.

 

Bronze is an alloy, so it's mostly copper but they throw in stuff like tin or aluminum into it, too. IF YOUR COIN HAS COPPER + TIN OR ALUMINUM IN IT, IT SHOULD WEIGH EVEN LESS THAN A PURE COPPER COIN. Density of aluminum is 20% of silver, and density of tin is 70% of silver, so the weight difference would be even more drastic.

 

At this point, save your money and forget about it. It's physically impossible to have a copper coin and a silver coin be the same volume and have the copper coin weight more. Math and chemistry will show you.

 

Thank you.

 

And it is not possible that some other alloy? Because the edge is a "bruising" is not like the others.

[alexbq2]

Thank you.

 

And it is not possible that some other alloy? Because the edge is a "bruising" is not like the others.

 

What's the edge like? Does it look cast? I don't see anything in the pictures, but it is not impossible that the coin is a counterfeit for circulation. Such coins are well known, I have a 10 kopeeks I showed here not too long ago, I also have a 20 kopeeks, and a 5 rouble coin. As such the coin is a mildly interesting curiosity, and can easily be worth $10 or even $20!

[Rhino]

Thank you.

 

And it is not possible that some other alloy? Because the edge is a "bruising" is not like the others.

 

Blackdrone, you're re-phrasing the question to try and get the answer you want...

 

If it was another "alloy" it wouldn't be bronze and it wouldn't be copper. You can't add anything except tin or aluminum to copper to get bronze. If you add something else, it's not bronze anymore.

 

If you think you have something rare, buy the coin. Make sure there's a 100% return policy, and then study the coin in detail and figure out the metal composition.

[Blackdrone]

Blackdrone, you're re-phrasing the question to try and get the answer you want...

 

If it was another "alloy" it wouldn't be bronze and it wouldn't be copper. You can't add anything except tin or aluminum to copper to get bronze. If you add something else, it's not bronze anymore.

 

If you think you have something rare, buy the coin. Make sure there's a 100% return policy, and then study the coin in detail and figure out the metal composition.

 

Thank you very much.

[Blackdrone]

What's the edge like? Does it look cast? I don't see anything in the pictures, but it is not impossible that the coin is a counterfeit for circulation. Such coins are well known, I have a 10 kopeeks I showed here not too long ago, I also have a 20 kopeeks, and a 5 rouble coin. As such the coin is a mildly interesting curiosity, and can easily be worth $10 or even $20!

 

Thank you.

[IgorS]

Just to set the record straight - at that time billon was used for striking minors. Billon here is an alloy of silver with copper. So in 15 kopeks only about half would be silver and the rest copper. If the coin like that is treated with harsh chemicals, it might have copper appearance. But I (as alexbq2) also was thinking about forgery for circulation from the period. I am just not sure if it made economic sense in 1912.

[Rhino]

Just to set the record straight - at that time billon was used for striking minors. Billon here is an alloy of silver with copper. So in 15 kopeks only about half would be silver and the rest copper. If the coin like that is treated with harsh chemicals, it might have copper appearance. But I (as alexbq2) also was thinking about forgery for circulation from the period. I am just not sure if it made economic sense in 1912.

 

An alloy of silver and copper interesting, somehow I never came across that. Good to know!

 

It should still weigh less than the purely silver type, since silver has the highest density out of the metals discussed earlier. You guys thinking of a forgery is a good idea, I like that... I'm curious about this coin, but that curiosity isn't worth $400.

[vit986]

The thing on the picture is a contemporary fake for the circulation. Made of crap and usially silvered. Worth a dollar or so.

[gxseries]

It can be either a genuine "silver" coin that has been copper washed or some cheap imitation coin. Even circulating Chinese 1 yuan coin worth 12 US cents are counterfeited so I guess it can be economical to counterfeit this coin as well?

[vit986]

It can be either a genuine "silver" coin that has been copper washed or some cheap imitation coin. Even circulating Chinese 1 yuan coin worth 12 US cents are counterfeited so I guess it can be economical to counterfeit this coin as well?

 

In this case - pretty clear it is what I said. It is quite common. I used to find one or two fakes like that in the bags of imperial billon while sorting for melting.