BKB Posted October 13, 2008 Report Share Posted October 13, 2008 It was not cheap, but I think it is worth it... And the original box too, from the looks of it. Again an ebay find. Too bad my camera or my hands operating that camera cannot capture the actual look of the medal. It would be interesting to collect all medals that are similar to coins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gxseries Posted October 13, 2008 Report Share Posted October 13, 2008 Unreal. Never expected to see one that comes in it's original box. Nice find! It's rather strange how the original 1834 commemorative ruble, struck much later in 1836, was actually designed by a German, Henry Gube. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YeOldeCollector Posted October 13, 2008 Report Share Posted October 13, 2008 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BKB Posted October 13, 2008 Author Report Share Posted October 13, 2008 Unreal. Never expected to see one that comes in it's original box. Nice find! It's rather strange how the original 1834 commemorative ruble, struck much later in 1836, was actually designed by a German, Henry Gube. Not only that, the design was taken from another german medal, almost copied. I do not have an image, but it was sold at the most recent Baldwin, so you could look it up. I read something about Gube a long time ago. I think his design of some medal won Impereal approval, and that the eagle designed by him for some medal became an official eagle used for coins. He became a favorite medallier of Nicholas for a period of time. The most interesting thing, I believe, about this medal is that it is designed by Utkin, not Gube. Even if I cannot afford a family 1 1/2, I have somithing related to coins done by a marvolous engraver. And I like the design better, because it has a much better portrait (IMXO) and does not have any of that additional text in field that distracts. Although, to be fair, medal allowed more space and depth to work with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IgorS Posted October 13, 2008 Report Share Posted October 13, 2008 ... It would be interesting to collect all medals that are similar to coins. Copycat in the house. I already did that. Never found medals similar to 1839 Borodino, 1912 Napoleon defeat or 1914 Gangut. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BKB Posted October 13, 2008 Author Report Share Posted October 13, 2008 Copycat in the house. I already did that. Never found medals similar to 1839 Borodino, 1912 Napoleon defeat or 1914 Gangut. Then it is even easier Let me buy your collection for a reasonable $, being that you already did that, so there is no more fun in it for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gxseries Posted October 13, 2008 Report Share Posted October 13, 2008 Yes, the Family ruble was modelled after the 1828 Bavarian thaler. An image can be seen here: http://numismaticon.com/catalog/Bavaria/co...1828---efca7aaa As far as I am aware, Gube modelled his coin after a portrait of Shilov's Column, Gorfried Mainers’s 1823 Polish 10 zlot coin, and Utkin with his 1834 Column medal. I'm still looking for Shilov's design - haven't had much success at the moment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BKB Posted October 13, 2008 Author Report Share Posted October 13, 2008 Check this out: http://sixbid.com/nav.php?p=viewlot&sid=80&lot=728 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gxseries Posted October 13, 2008 Report Share Posted October 13, 2008 Thanks for the link BKB! Interesting, never noticed anything like that. Btw going back a bit, wasn't there a couple of medals that used similar text where it commemorated the 100th anniversary of the Napoleon defeat? For instance this: http://www.anythinganywhere.com/commerce/m...cent-w128-1.jpg I got it from this page here: http://www.anythinganywhere.com/commerce/m...-imp-medals.htm I never noticed how many medals there were that used "ne nam, ne nam, a imeni tvoemy". Thought it was the only text that appeared in Pavel I coinage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loyal Citizen Posted October 13, 2008 Report Share Posted October 13, 2008 It was not cheap, but I think it is worth it... And the original box too, from the looks of it. Again an ebay find. Too bad my camera or my hands operating that camera cannot capture the actual look of the medal. It would be interesting to collect all medals that are similar to coins. Here is her "sister" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loyal Citizen Posted October 13, 2008 Report Share Posted October 13, 2008 #2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill Posted October 13, 2008 Report Share Posted October 13, 2008 Gorgeous medal. You could post it in the Exonumia thread! Welcome to the true darkside. It really is a beautiful medal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gxseries Posted October 13, 2008 Report Share Posted October 13, 2008 Nice one Loyal Citizen. Is that the medal Shilov designed or by another engraver? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BKB Posted October 13, 2008 Author Report Share Posted October 13, 2008 If you know, who designed the sister? Sadly, I do not have many medal books, so I cannot look up either of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grivna1726 Posted October 13, 2008 Report Share Posted October 13, 2008 #2 Very interesting. It becomes apparent in this thread that one could form a specialized collection of medals which are all related to or inspired by earlier column medals. It seems to be a much more popular theme than I knew. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loyal Citizen Posted October 13, 2008 Report Share Posted October 13, 2008 If you know, who designed the sister? Sadly, I do not have many medal books, so I cannot look up either of them. Even though the medal is unsigned, it is definite work of P. Utkin. This is not Shilov definetely - first of all, he died in 1827; second, he specialized in the Alexander I portraits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IgorS Posted October 14, 2008 Report Share Posted October 14, 2008 Thanks for the link BKB! Interesting, never noticed anything like that. Btw going back a bit, wasn't there a couple of medals that used similar text where it commemorated the 100th anniversary of the Napoleon defeat? For instance this: http://www.anythinganywhere.com/commerce/m...cent-w128-1.jpg ... Yes, but they do not really look like the commemorative coins for the same events (or the other way around). Thare are medals that look exactly like commemorative coins from 1834, 1841, 1898, 1912 A3 monument. 1859 and 1913 look very similar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grivna1726 Posted October 14, 2008 Report Share Posted October 14, 2008 It was not cheap, but I think it is worth it... And the original box too, from the looks of it. Again an ebay find. Too bad my camera or my hands operating that camera cannot capture the actual look of the medal. It would be interesting to collect all medals that are similar to coins. So, is the coin copied from the medal, or is the medal copied from the coin? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BKB Posted October 14, 2008 Author Report Share Posted October 14, 2008 #2 Why is your medal dated 1830?! I thought the column was erected in 1832 and finished in 1834! I am not even sure from the info I read if the project was ready in 1830... Very interesting... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IgorS Posted October 14, 2008 Report Share Posted October 14, 2008 So, is the coin copied from the medal, or is the medal copied from the coin? I think it depends on each individual case. For 1859, 1898 and 1912 A3 commemoratives roubles there are the same size/look medals without word "rouble". During the celebration of all of the above events different size medals were struck to be given to officials (the same actually applies to many other events for which medals were struck). The higher was the rank of the official, the larger was the medal. The rouble sized ones were struck for village elders (or something like that). And if I remember correctly, the coin dies were taken and adjusted slightly to make those medals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IgorS Posted October 14, 2008 Report Share Posted October 14, 2008 Here is 86mm! job for 1859 medal. The reverse is the same as the coin, but the obverse has a different portrait. Nicholas I is wearing Preobrazhensky Lige Guards Regiment helmet. This helmet would not fit on a small (in comparison) coin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IgorS Posted October 14, 2008 Report Share Posted October 14, 2008 Why is your medal dated 1830?! I thought the column was erected in 1832 and finished in 1834! I am not even sure from the info I read if the project was ready in 1830... Very interesting... The Ground Breaking was in 1830. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grivna1726 Posted October 14, 2008 Report Share Posted October 14, 2008 Here is 86mm! job for 1859 medal. The reverse is the same as the coin, but the obverse has a different portrait. Nicholas I is wearing Preobrazhensky Lige Guards Regiment helmet. This helmet would not fit on a small (in comparison) coin. Igor, thank you for your characteristically helpful and informative reply. I don't think I have seen this particular obverse/reverse combination medal before (or at least I do not remember it if I have). My guess is that this medal is quite rare. The portrait of Nicholas I shown on your medal is reminiscent of the portrait of Alexander I used on the medal series commemorating the defeat of Napoleon following the French invasion of Russia in 1812. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loyal Citizen Posted October 14, 2008 Report Share Posted October 14, 2008 Why is your medal dated 1830?! I thought the column was erected in 1832 and finished in 1834! I am not even sure from the info I read if the project was ready in 1830... Very interesting... Actually, in 1830, the foundation of the column started. You are right, it was completed in 1834 - that's when the first Russian commemorative rouble (and the medal you showed above) was struck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gxseries Posted October 14, 2008 Report Share Posted October 14, 2008 I believe the first commemorative ruble was the Kolyvan gold coin struck in 1832 if we ignore the early 1757 commemorative 5 kopek which remains missing. Family ruble came in 1835and the Alexander Column ruble was struck in 1836, not 1834. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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