Prethen Posted July 18, 2008 Report Share Posted July 18, 2008 I recently acquired a handful of BU 1898-O Morgans. The strikes aren't fantastic, but most have fairly nice luster. I will eventually put all of these up for sale, but I'd love to get your opinions as to grade and how you rate them for eye appeal. Which is the best/worst? Also, I realize that the VAM is probably without interest...what VAM does it appear? The "O" appears high and there doesn't appear to be any doubling of and of the date digits. Finally, what do you think these should be selling for? Thanks! #1 #2 #3 #4 #5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LostDutchman Posted July 18, 2008 Report Share Posted July 18, 2008 they all look like your pretty standard original bag/roll morgans... Those usually grade 63's and 64's Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moneydog Posted July 18, 2008 Report Share Posted July 18, 2008 First one VF-20 worth $20.00 Second VF-25 worth $21.00 Third VF-25 worth $21.00 Forth VF-25 --------------- Fifth VF-25 ----------------- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prethen Posted July 18, 2008 Author Report Share Posted July 18, 2008 Moneydog, I appreciate your conservative grades. However, I believe without exception, all are uncirculated with full luster (with subdued luster on one...hazy). What you might be observing is strike weakness not wear. If these coins had anything worse than AU wear, especially, in the VF range, you'd see considerable metal loss/wear all over the coin and lots of detail loss. For instance, the cotton bolls on Liberty give you one clue as to how much circulation the coin may have seen. None of the coins above show a hint of wear on those nor are there any signs of wear on any of the high points. However, there might be "rub" as you'd find on coins that have rubbed against one another in a bag. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Stilson Posted July 18, 2008 Report Share Posted July 18, 2008 I agree with LD on grades. Like you say Prethen New Orleans was known for weak strikes. You can really tell on the hair close to the initials of the last one. BTW they probably are VAM 4's. (Say do you mind if I drop a picture of the mint mark in on Vamworld? Since they don't have one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LostDutchman Posted July 18, 2008 Report Share Posted July 18, 2008 the ever lasting strike vs. wear debate!!!! aahh!! these are without question uncs. Maybe we should start an strike versus wear thread.. that might be a good educational thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prethen Posted July 18, 2008 Author Report Share Posted July 18, 2008 Sure - use whatever you'd like. I couldn't quite figure out the VAM based on The VAM book and it seemed to be a toss up. I think the first one in there (I guess it's VAM 4 like you suggest) makes the most sense to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoRnholio Posted July 18, 2008 Report Share Posted July 18, 2008 Maybe we should start an strike versus wear thread.. that might be a good educational thread. I would gladly read a thread about this topic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moneydog Posted July 18, 2008 Report Share Posted July 18, 2008 That goes for me too. I talked to LDR and he set me stright on what to look for they are unc I agree I was grading on bagmarks sorry about those numbers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hiho Posted July 19, 2008 Report Share Posted July 19, 2008 I agree with LD, all look to be UNC, MS62-MS63. Great photos by the way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Stilson Posted July 19, 2008 Report Share Posted July 19, 2008 Sure - use whatever you'd like. I couldn't quite figure out the VAM based on The VAM book and it seemed to be a toss up. I think the first one in there (I guess it's VAM 4 like you suggest) makes the most sense to me. Thanks I did a cut and paste to show the mint mark on VAMWorld. ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ccg Posted July 19, 2008 Report Share Posted July 19, 2008 MS62-3ish. First one I'd go MS60 since the marks on the face are rather distracting (IMO). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harpo Posted July 19, 2008 Report Share Posted July 19, 2008 I agree with LD, all look to be UNC, MS62-MS63. Great photos by the way. I agree. 62 to 63. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tokenchris Posted July 20, 2008 Report Share Posted July 20, 2008 Hi, I don't want to bring you guys all down.... but it could be also a nice China fake Morgan Dollar only! These 1898 Morgan's pop-up everywhere in similar quality like the one on the pictures provided. How much worth?.... Nothing much once identified as a China fake. Check this article out... have a look at all pictures.... special the Morgan Dollar fakes are in superb quality!. http://coins.about.com/od/worldcoins/ig/Ch...oin-Minting.htm Regards Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
logger99 Posted July 20, 2008 Report Share Posted July 20, 2008 they all look like your pretty standard original bag/roll morgans... Those usually grade 63's and 64's IMO I would say MS61, 63, 61, 63, 63 The toning on one of the end coins is not the kind of toning that draws the best attention The thing that makes coins 1 and 3 grade low is the very weak strike, especially on eagles breast and some scratches that definitely take away from eye appeal. The thing that these coins do have going for them are their pretty much mark free fields. Check your PCGS price guides at PCGS.com for some idea of their value. If you sell them, (like on Ebay) expect to get 40-50% of the price guide value. Sold as raw coins, they WILL NOT fetch what a slabbed and certified coin from PCGS would get. Especially given that the 1898 O Morgan is so common. At the very least, you should get from $15-20. Might get more if certified by PCGS, but adding the cost of certification wouldn't be feasible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prethen Posted July 20, 2008 Author Report Share Posted July 20, 2008 Well, Chris, I feel fortunate that the Chinese seller I bought my last batch of 1243 coins (mainly dollars) from had no feedback so I think there's a good chance he's okay. Any chance you have a picture of one of these fabulous fakes? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harpo Posted July 20, 2008 Report Share Posted July 20, 2008 Well, Chris, I feel fortunate that the Chinese seller I bought my last batch of 1243 coins (mainly dollars) from had no feedback so I think there's a good chance he's okay. Any chance you have a picture of one of these fabulous fakes? Did these Morgans come from China? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prethen Posted July 20, 2008 Author Report Share Posted July 20, 2008 The provenance of these items precedes all the recent crap coming from China. However, I'd be curious to know just how "good" this Chinese junk is. Yeah, they can fake coins and put them in convincing slabs, but how do these coins look and feel raw. I've dealt with thousands of Morgans. I doubt very much that they have the total look and feel of a real Morgan, especially with widgets such as above. And, if by some chance they did replicate the silver and the strike, I guess the point would be moot as it would take a scientist to tell the difference. It's only worth it for them to spend the time and use the proper alloys for rare, collector coins. Widgets will generally be made of crap metal and/or quality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle Charlie Posted July 20, 2008 Report Share Posted July 20, 2008 #1-MS63 #2-MS62 #3-MS62/63~Light wear on hair above ear? #4-MS63~best eye appeal #5-MS61/62~finger prints Your coins are fairly average uncirculated pieces. As for the price, I'd say 25-35 dollars apiece. The light toning on all your coins gives them a nice look. #3 was difficult to grade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
numismatic nut Posted July 21, 2008 Report Share Posted July 21, 2008 Not to down talk your beautyful coins but #3 has a finger print or two at 6'k. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tokenchris Posted July 21, 2008 Report Share Posted July 21, 2008 Well, Chris, I feel fortunate that the Chinese seller I bought my last batch of 1243 coins (mainly dollars) from had no feedback so I think there's a good chance he's okay. Any chance you have a picture of one of these fabulous fakes? Hi, just "click" on the link in my post. There are lot's of images the whole article is 24 ++ pages..... If you bought from a "Chinaman" most likely they come from that place from the report. Regards Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harpo Posted July 22, 2008 Report Share Posted July 22, 2008 Also, I realize that the VAM is probably without interest...what VAM does it appear? The "O" appears high and there doesn't appear to be any doubling of and of the date digits. I would say it's a Vam-4. Vamworld.com 1898-O Vam 4 Compared to yours: Looks very similar. The provenance of these items precedes all the recent crap coming from China. Whew! I was afraid the Chinese were getting Way Too good at it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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