bobh Posted December 18, 2009 Report Share Posted December 18, 2009 Here's the link: UBS auction 84 Russian lots start at lot #1524. Some lots are a bit strange: Polushka 1727. "Novodel" - looks like a fantasy or fake to me. Neither this one nor the next one is listed in Bitkin. 10 Kopeek 1762, "Novodel" This coin has an estimate of CHF 80 (about $80), whereas the following 1913 commemorative roubles have estimates of around $150: 1913 rouble (business strike!) There is also a nice uncirculated 1790-AM pyatak, but they put the estimate at CHF 800! Does anyone think it has a chance to sell for that price? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STEVE MOULDING Posted December 18, 2009 Report Share Posted December 18, 2009 Thanks Bob The 1727 and 1762 'Novodels' are cheap fakes, I've seen them before. I'm surprised at UBS for cataloging such rubbish. A Dassier estimated at 800CHF ? Interesting doubling of Catherine's portrait Best, Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squirrel Posted December 18, 2009 Report Share Posted December 18, 2009 Interesting doubling of Catherine's portrait thats 4 chins total Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STEVE MOULDING Posted December 18, 2009 Report Share Posted December 18, 2009 thats 4 chins total Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexbq2 Posted December 18, 2009 Report Share Posted December 18, 2009 How about this Armavir? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexbq2 Posted December 18, 2009 Report Share Posted December 18, 2009 You’d think UBS could afford to hire someone competent to sort out their investments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RW Julian Posted December 19, 2009 Report Share Posted December 19, 2009 How about this Armavir? False. RWJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grivna1726 Posted December 19, 2009 Report Share Posted December 19, 2009 A Dassier estimated at 800CHF ? Maybe there really is a Santa Claus... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IgorS Posted December 20, 2009 Report Share Posted December 20, 2009 Not a bad auction. Just when I thought this winter season will be boring for me - things started popping up here and there. That's another beauty of our hobby - you never know where your next coin will come from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobh Posted January 5, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 Народ ... I just went to Basel today and looked at the coins of interest to me at UBS. I told them about the three fake coins we have discovered, but the only person I was able to speak with was some young apprentice who knows nothing about coins... SO ... Unfortunately, I have seldom seen such a collection of cleaned coins as today. Not going to bid on ANY lots! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
altyn Posted January 6, 2010 Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 They do not provide the option of bidding by internet, do they? There is still a couple of coins I'd be tempted to bid on. My collection is mainly gaps with occasional occurrence of coins, here and there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobh Posted January 6, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 They do not provide the option of bidding by internet, do they? There is still a couple of coins I'd be tempted to bid on. My collection is mainly gaps with occasional occurrence of coins, here and there. You can send a write-in bid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobh Posted January 21, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 21, 2010 PR is here now: Prices realized, UBS auction 84 Lot of stuff didn't sell...the Amavir fakes (lots 1876/77) were either withdrawn or didn't sell; similarly the 1727 "polushka" (lot 1582) didn't sell. Can't tell that they were actually withdrawn before the auction, however, because there were other lots listed as "Z" (for "zurückgezogen" = withdrawn) and these lots were not listed at all. 10 Kopeek 1762, "Novodel" Wasn't withdrawn, although I told them in person that this is a fake/fantasy coin. They actually sold it for CHF 400! There is also a nice uncirculated 1790-AM pyatak, but they put the estimate at CHF 800! Does anyone think it has a chance to sell for that price? Lot 1676 -- sold for CHF 1300! Am I missing something here, or is this another example of price madness?? It even had a small verdigris spot on the field between the left eagle's head and the crown ... probably not visible in the catalog, but in person. Lot 1891 was a problem lot ... 20 different coins, some very rare things (i.e. two Baroque kopecks, one MMD and the other SPB in VF -- no rim cuts! ) as well as a 1762 ten kopeck (illustrated in catalog) and 4 kopecks but in terrible shape. Also, there was a 2 Para/3 Kopeck for Moldavia -- nice detail, but WITH a large rim cut. The rest were common dates in VG/F, all belonging in the dealers junk box IMHO. This lot sold for CHF 800, which I consider a bargain because the two Baroque kopecks offered are worth at least that much. Anyone get anything interesting from this auction? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobh Posted January 21, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 21, 2010 The 1727 and 1762 'Novodels' are cheap fakes, I've seen them before. I'm surprised at UBS for cataloging such rubbish. As mentioned in my previous post, the 1762 "novodel" actually sold for CHF 400. A Dassier estimated at 800CHF ? PR = CHF 21,000 Interesting doubling of Catherine's portrait PR = CHF 500 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STEVE MOULDING Posted January 21, 2010 Report Share Posted January 21, 2010 PR is here now:Prices realized, UBS auction 84 Thanks Bob Lot 1891....I consider a bargain Did you buy it?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobh Posted January 21, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 21, 2010 Thanks Bob Lot 1891....I consider a bargain Did you buy it?? No -- I didn't bid on anything. There was only one coin I was particularly interested in (the 1907 poltina), but it turned out to be harshly cleaned. As a copper collector, what do you make of the 1790-AM 5 kopeck piece going for well over $1,000? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STEVE MOULDING Posted January 21, 2010 Report Share Posted January 21, 2010 :As a copper collector, what do you make of the 1790-AM 5 kopeck piece going for well over $1,000? Higher-end condition coins I'm never really that surprised when they sell well. Averages and expectations out on the tail of a distribution are notoriously unreliable for most things in life and coins are no exception. This one...well I think it may have sold for twice what it should, but certainly not 10x. That said, I wouldn't pay it...I typically value rarity over condition, but that's just me. To some people I know condition is everything and to be sure this is one of the best 1790AM 5Ks I've seen. Just my 3c. Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobh Posted January 22, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 22, 2010 10 Kopeek 1762, "Novodel" Just realized that this one is depicted in the Brekke/Bakken 1997 supplement (p. 116, fig. 53). VERY embarrassing IMHO for UBS to have actually sold this one to some trusting buyer! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobh Posted January 22, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 22, 2010 Higher-end condition coins I'm never really that surprised when they sell well. Averages and expectations out on the tail of a distribution are notoriously unreliable for most things in life and coins are no exception. This one...well I think it may have sold for twice what it should, but certainly not 10x. That said, I wouldn't pay it...I typically value rarity over condition, but that's just me. To some people I know condition is everything and to be sure this is one of the best 1790AM 5Ks I've seen. Just my 3c. Steve Thanks, Steve. There was another 1790-AM coin in the Tom Willy Bakken sale at G&M which had an estimate of only €80 on it, but it didn't sell (lot 7278). If anything, I think the Bakken coin is nicer than the UBS one! I expected the UBS coin not to sell at all due to (a) the overpriced estimate of CHF 800, and ( even if it had had a more realistic estimate of CHF 200 or so, it did have a spot of verdigris on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobh Posted January 22, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 22, 2010 Just realized that this one is depicted in the Brekke/Bakken 1997 supplement (p. 116, fig. 53). VERY embarrassing IMHO for UBS to have actually sold this one to some trusting buyer! I just sent them a long email together with scans from the Brekke/Bakken supplement ... will be interesting to hear what they have to say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STEVE MOULDING Posted January 22, 2010 Report Share Posted January 22, 2010 Just realized that this one is depicted in the Brekke/Bakken 1997 supplement (p. 116, fig. 53). VERY embarrassing IMHO for UBS to have actually sold this one to some trusting buyer! Let us know if they reply :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobh Posted August 10, 2010 Author Report Share Posted August 10, 2010 Here's the link: UBS auction 84Russian lots start at lot #1524. Some lots are a bit strange: Polushka 1727. "Novodel" - looks like a fantasy or fake to me. Neither this one nor the next one is listed in Bitkin. 10 Kopeek 1762, "Novodel" UBS auction 85 - Sept. 7-8, 2010 They don't give up, do they? Lot 1406: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grivna1726 Posted August 10, 2010 Report Share Posted August 10, 2010 UBS auction 85 - Sept. 7-8, 2010They don't give up, do they? Lot 1406: Pathetic. Is this miserable fake the same example of this "novodel" that was previously offered by UBS? LINK to image (for future reference). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobh Posted August 11, 2010 Author Report Share Posted August 11, 2010 Pathetic. Is this miserable fake the same example of this "novodel" that was previously offered by UBS?LINK to image (for future reference). Yes. It is easy to tell because of the off-centered strike. In auction 84, the estimate was CHF 200. Fortunately, though, it didn't sell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grivna1726 Posted August 11, 2010 Report Share Posted August 11, 2010 Yes. It is easy to tell because of the off-centered strike. In auction 84, the estimate was CHF 200. Fortunately, though, it didn't sell. I wasn't sure because it seems I didn't save the image from the previous auction and it is now gone from the UBS website ("Page not found"). But the piece sure looked familiar. Either UBS knows what it is and doesn't care or else actually believes it is genuine . Neither possibility inspires confidence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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