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Drusus

Tooled and ugly

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I mention in another thread a while back I thought a coin might be tooled. Someone asked what tooling is...there are varying stages of tooling...some might tool a coin lightly to bring out a bit of detail, some might, in essence, carve the full image back on a coin that has been worn down almost completely...

 

Tooling is when a person takes a very worn coin and carves the detail back...some people are good at this and when done right it might even fool people...some...well...here is a good example of a terrible tooled coined that was posted on another forum...it might be the WORST case of tooling I have ever seen...many tooled coins are not so obvious but this is a good one to use because pretty much every problem a tooled coin might have is represented here...and as a side note, this coin sold for 750.00 dollars...most likely all it was originally when found was a slug...this coin seems completely carved and colored....

 

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This is supposed to be a Nero Claudius Drusus Coin. Estimated price 950!! Authenticity 'Garantied!'

 

Here is the actual coin...even on the worst of days, missing an eye and hung over or drunk the Roman did not produce such awful coins and even in the late empire they did not product such garbage.

 

RIC_0109-o.jpg

 

 

RIC_0109-r.jpg

 

 

This is one of the men I took my handle for because I think not only are his REAL coins stunning (most from this time are), they were great roman figures...

 

This person just bilk someone out of 750 dollars and sold a coin worth 000!!

 

I am going to use these coins and post a page on my site about tooling and how one can tell when a coin is tooled..maybe it will help someone some day not get ripped off like the buyer in this auction

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Nice read Drusus :ninja: You say someone actualy paid $750 for that ;)

 

De Orc ;)

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yup..I tried to contact the buyer and warn him...something I have always done...but ebay seems to be blocking contact between buyers and now are protecting buyers from being warn they are getting scammed...750 bucks is a lot to pay to learn a lesson...when he is all proud of his new rare coin and finds out its junk and the seller is no longer on ebay (or under another name).

 

sad...but I guess if that coin fooled the buyer, he / she shouldnt have been buying ancients as they just dont know much about them...this coin screams tooling to anyone with any knowledge of Julio Claudian area roman coins (or ANY ancient coin for that matter).

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I am finding lately that some of the most tooled and smoothed coins are from Thrace, Pantikapaion, Chersonessos, and Olbia. It is as though after these coins are dug up they are shipped off to the tooling factory somewhere in Ukraine or perhaps Bulgaria where the rough surfaces are smoothed and alleged details added to the coin. I have even noticed some from Mesembria lately which leads to the Bulgarian possibility.

 

These coins are very common on eBay, and a few are slipping into Vcoins lately.

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I know next to nothing about ancients, and even I knew that something was up with that coin! Thanks for the example, Drusus. You should post a link to your site when you finish that section, I'm really interested in reading it.

 

eBay really needs to find another way to prevent fraud/etc. without hiding buyers' contacts.

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eBay really needs to find another way to prevent fraud/etc. without hiding buyers' contacts.

 

 

One of the frustrating things with the eBay venue is that it is a pain to report stuff, and you risk getting Naru'ed if someone thinks you are just interfering with their auction. Basically you better have all your ducks in a row and back up your case before you ever press it.

 

Frankly I don't care to buy ancients on eBay and haven't in sometime. Remember that eBay is a user based community, and as such a minority of the users are there for less than desirous behaviours, particularly in certain interest sections.

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I will post a link to the page here when I get it up, working on it now. I DO buy ancients on ebay but I am very careful and I think, to date, I have never bought a fake or tooled coin (on ebay, I have bought a fake coin). I have seen plenty of coins that have seen for sale on ebay as natural and very worn reappear after being bought as a tooled coin.

 

I understand why ebay thinks they should limit the ability of members to contact other members but I think they should allow it and then let the members themselves report improper contact. I have, since I have been on ebay, contacted MANY users to warn them of fraud. Some ignore me, some are very happy to have dodged a bullet.

 

I think it is fine to buy ancients on ebay...but in general. if you dont know much about them...its best not to buy them at all until you learn more. When you DO buy them...always show them off to get opinion and a consensus. Whenever I buy an ancient I post it on ancients forums just to see what the experts have to say about it...There are some very good dealer on ebay who would never knowing sell a tooled or fake coin. And you can sometimes get a real good deal. But like anything on ebay...you just have to watch out...know what to look for...and deal with a seller who has a god reputation at least...if the dealer has sold thousands of ancient on ebay...most likely that dealer is at elast trying to keep a good rep and it they DO sell you a fake or tooled coin and you want a refund, most likely they will refund instead of ruining a good reputation.

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I will post a link to the page here when I get it up, working on it now. I DO buy ancients on ebay but I am very careful and I think, to date, I have never bought a fake or tooled coin (on ebay, I have bought a fake coin). I have seen plenty of coins that have seen for sale on ebay as natural and very worn reappear after being bought as a tooled coin.

 

 

I haven't bought ancients on eBay in years now, I think the last was an Ionia Miletos 1/12 stater, not much risk of it being fake, and it was accurately described. Only curious thing about the deal was that the seller was listed in Germany but when he contacted me he said the coin would be mailed from Turkey. Turkey has strict regulations regarding exports of antiquities, even coins. He also explained that the customs form would state that it was a replica, but that was to get it through customs. I received the coin with no problems, and am very confident of it's authenticity, just didn't like how the deal went through ~ wisht the seller was a bit more upfront about his actual location.

 

miletos.jpg

My son did buy an Olbian dolphin from a seller in Odesa, Ukraine - but that was a completely problem free transaction. Now my daughter(really into dolphins)wants one and we cannot find one good enough for her.

 

olbiya2.jpg

 

These day the majority of my ancients come from Vcoins, I find these tend to be the nicer coins that will not end up on eBay because - well - they are nicer, and albeit pricier than typical eBay anicents.

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I dont know...I also shop at vcoins, forum and a few other places but you can find some nice coins and good deals on ebay...I just bought a pretty sweet Probus for a good price there not a week ago.

 

forum acient coins has some dolphins but most seem in poor shape

 

http://www.forumancientcoins.com/index2.as...com/nof-src.asp

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Wow - I don't think I've seen something tooled from nothing.

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I'm also suprised that there were any bids over $20 (I would pay $20 myself as a novelty) - the hair detail is awfully suspicious. It's like seeing a state quarter obverse on a '65 quarter.

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I am finding lately that some of the most tooled and smoothed coins are from Thrace, Pantikapaion, Chersonessos, and Olbia. It is as though after these coins are dug up they are shipped off to the tooling factory somewhere in Ukraine or perhaps Bulgaria where the rough surfaces are smoothed and alleged details added to the coin. I have even noticed some from Mesembria lately which leads to the Bulgarian possibility.

 

These coins are very common on eBay, and a few are slipping into Vcoins lately.

 

Here are three highly tooled & smoothed ones that were on VCoins. However they were sold by a dealer that specifically said they'd been messed with. Unfortunately it's all to easy to find Bosporus Kingdom & surrounding area coins that have been messed with...

 

 

Z4923LG.jpg

 

Z4914LG.jpg

 

AC15475LG.jpg

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