In a few days the world coin collectors will know whether the list of countries to collect will soon be a little longer or not. Montenegro, which was independent and issues its own coins until WW1, may start doing that again.

This Sunday, 21 May, the voters in Montenegro (Crna Gora) will decide whether the federation with Serbia should be phased out. Montenegro - with a population of about roughly 650,000 - continued to be part of Yugoslavia when other republics such as Croatia or Macedonia became independent. Currently Serbia and Montenegro are autonomous parts of a federation, with Serbia being the much bigger and more influential part.

Serbia and Montenegro agreed on two criteria for this election: For Montenegro to become independent, at least 50 percent of the 480,000 people who may vote need to participate, and (as the European Union had suggested) at least 55 percent of the votes have to be pro-independence.

The reasoning behind the two hurdles was that a possible independence should be supported by a stable majority. Problem is, if more than 50 but less than 55 percent vote for Montenegro's independence, will both camps simply accept the outcome? Seems that many people in Montenegro want the independence, but an almost equally large group thinks that the continuation of the federation is better.

The election info is rather background material, and not meant to start a political debate. But now that Slovenia joins the European Currency Union, it would be interesting if another country nearby started issuing new coins and notes ...

Christian

It will be interesting to watch. Would Montenegro then have the opportunity to join the EU on it's own?

Sure, basically yes. Now whether an independent Montenegro has better chances of joining than a united federal S&M, that is a different question.

As for the currency, that is another interesting thing. Currently Montenegro uses the euro (without any formal agreement), but that may simply be due to the fact that they want to be different from Serbia which has its own dinar ...

Christian

I think you are mis-reading the numbers. At least 50% of the 480,000 registered voters (240,000 votes) are needed for the election to be considered a true vote. Of the actual votes cast (240,000+), only 55% have to be pro-independence. So, in reality, the fate of Montenegro lies in the hands of 132,000 voters.

I would say that yes, Montenegro would have better chances to enter the EU as an independent nation. Serbia has been trying for a couple years to appease the EU board, but is still unable to provide the most crucial pieces of the puzzle that the EU (via the Hague Tribunal) has requested.... Ratko Mladic and Radovan Karadzic.

Yes, that is what I meant when I wrote that "at least 50 percent of the 480,000 people who may vote need to participate, and (...) at least 55 percent of the votes have to be pro-independence." The "problem" that I referred to was, what happens if between 50 and 55 percent (of those who vote, that is) vote for the independence? Such an outcome - which is quite likely - would be difficult to deal with for both the "separatists" and the "unionists".

Politically an independent Montenegro would indeed have a better chance of becoming an EU member some time in the future. Economically however ... In either case, that process would probably take many years.

Edit: Seems that more than 80% voted, and a little more than 55% voted Yes. So Montenegro is about to become independent. As for what currency they will use, well, we will see ...

Christian

Close call. I am still waiting until tomorrow morning when the CFED official count is released. I do hope it passes. As for currency, they have un-officially declared the Euro as their "legal tender of state", so why would they change that?? I wonder how long it will take for them to get the international recognition. Then they can get the wheels in motion to join the EU and make the euro official.

International recognition in terms of UN membership, for example, will not take long. Joining the Council of Europe should be fairly fast and smooth as well: Pretty much every European country is a CoE member; the only exceptions are Belarus and the Vatican. An EU membership will be more difficult - that is not going to happen any time soon.

As for what currency Montenegro will use, my impression was that they used the mark, and later the euro, primarily to set themselves apart from Serbia. What currency they use is basically their business and has nothing to do with a membership in the European Currency Union, but I thought that an independent Montenegro might want to use its own cash. Maybe I was wrong.

Christian

They used the DM and the Euro less to set themselves apart from Serbia, and more to give their economy stability and lessen inflation. Had they used the Dinara, they would have had incredible inflation and revalued currency every few years. It was a wise decision.

Makes sense, but they could have issued their own coins. The currencies of, say, Bosnia-Hercegovina or Bulgaria are also pegged to the euro, and yet they have different names and coins. But perhaps I am seeing this too much from a coin collector's point of view.

Christian

As an aside, are their (now-obsolete) DM-convertable paper still exchangeable?

I believe Bosnia Herzogovina is still using the Konvertibla Marka, which was pegged to the DM. I am sure Christian can give a specific date limit for redemption but German DM's are still exchangable. France was the tightest about when you could exchange old for new.

Yes, the BAM (Bosnian Marka), also known as the Bosnia KM, was pegged to the DM. On January 1, 2002, when the Euro replaced the DM as the official currency of Germany, the BAM became convertible to the Euro at the frozen rate established by the EU (just over ½ euro per KM). So any Bosnian KM notes are still legal tender, just convertible to a different currency than originally issued.




Not actually circulation issues, but the government of Montenegro did authorize the minting of 2 sets of coins, both dated 2002. The first set was designed like the early 1906-1908 issues of the Principality, while the second set was designed like the later 1912-1914 issues of the Kingdom.

link to Central Bank of Montenegro

The base-metal coins are available in an 8-piece set (4 pieces of Principality & 4 pieces of Kingdom), but I haven't seen any on the market recently (for a while back in the winter, they were all over eBay.de)

Christian cannot since there is no such date limit. You can always change DM cash into € cash. Don't know where you got the information about France from, but Belgium, Greece, Luxembourg and Portugal were all "tighter", ie. they had earlier redemption deadlines for pre-euro coins.

Christian

Technical side note: The euro replaced the mark on 1 January 1999 and could be used for any transaction that did not involve cash. It just took three years to fully change over. (Slovenia for example can do that much faster now.)


That is interesting - I have never seen those before. OK, they are not really coins, but still a very nice set. And maybe a model for the future? Not in terms of "principality" and "kingdom" but in terms of cash ...

Christian

Banque de France has a schedule of redemption for older notes, I am not sure what it is now, but I think the last Franc denominated notes can be redeemed until 2008 or so. The earliest notes that could have been exchanged were the 1945 notes in the old Francs, they were the first to lose redemption status though.

France has been even harsher on coins, I believe now none of them can be redeemed. The last time I was there in 2000 everybody kept reminding me that the 100 Franc coins I wanted to get in change(because they were silver) would not be any good after 2002.

Since we are going off-topic here, I'll reply in a new discussion.
http://www.coinpeople.com/Redemption-Periods-t9524.html

Christian