I can spend them when I get them, it's just that I try to avoid getting them. ;-)

I usually spend SACs and SBAs and sometimes even Ikes, along with Kennedys. They're pretty easy to get around where I live.

The bill apparently passed the House and is headed for the President's desk.

Well, that's it, I guess. Dub hasn't figured out how to veto a bill yet. 'Course, he's only had the job for 5 years..... ;-)

What version survived? House or Senate?

There were folks at the local Post Office the other day who were complaining because they were only getting SBAs in change from the machine and wanted SACs for Christmas presents.

House Vote 624: Dec 13, 2005 (109th Congress)
This information comes from the U.S. House website, an official source for voting records.

On Motion to Suspend the Rules and Pass: S 1047 To require the Secretary of the Treasury to mint coins in commemoration of each of the Nation’s past President and their spouses, respectively, to improve circulation of the $1 coin, to create a new bullion coin, and for other purposes -- Passed

Totals
Ayes: 291 (67%)
Nays: 113 (26%)
Not Voting: 29 (7%)
Required: 2/3

It just made it.

So, what does all this mean? My understanding is that the House has passed the Senate version of the bill so we won't be seeing any living ex-presidents on the coins. We will see 4 differant designs on the 2009 cent and a new .999 fine gold bullion "Buffalo". Just needs the presidents signature and its also my understanding that no president has ever vetoed a bill regarding coin design.

Oh, and the glut of sackies.

That was my reading too. I think they passed the bill as is from the Senate. I didn't know it was that close, though.

So will all vending machines have to be reconfigured to accept 3 different dollar coins?

All the machines where I work already take the SBA and Sacky. The new President coins will be minted on the same planchets as the Sacky.
I've never seen a machine that took an Ike.(Probably only the slots in Vages)

A-haa, okay. Finally something that makes sense from the Mint. Thanks for clarification.

< So will all vending machines have to be reconfigured to accept 3 different dollar coins? >

No reconfiguring needed, just flip the switch from refuse dollars to accept dollars. All three dollar coins supposedly have the same dimensions, weight and electromagnetic signature so any of them should work.

Same in all the ones here. I remember whe the sacky first came out they made a big deal about it and all the vending machines where I work had little signs on them... We Take the Golden Dollar! With a pic of said Sacky on it.

You have vending machines in your basement?

That was erm 5 years ago, Bud.

I have some of Sackie stickers around here. I even have a small one on my computer case. In fact, it is right next to my bunny butt.

The green guy has a bunny butt.........

The House and the Fed. are concerned about the 1/3 sacky thing too.
From the debate on the bill last week.....rep. M. Oxley, Ohio

Much more serious is a provision in the Senate bill that was not in the House bill and which will, in my estimation, cause some problems as the Presidential dollar program goes forward, a requirement that a third of all the dollar coins issued during the life of the Presidential dollar program bear the Sakakawea design. Mr. Castle and Mrs. Maloney struck a good commonsense agreement with Mr. Pomeroy over the House version of this bill that would have continued minting Sakakawea design coins to meet demand throughout the life of the Presidential dollar and then return to full production of that design after the Presidential program is finished and the dollar coin establishes a useful and well-circulating medium of exchange.

Mr. Speaker, although not the fault of the design of Sakakawea herself, there will not be the same demand for the Sakakawea coins as for the Presidents, because there will be no real change in the design of the coin from year to year. The problem, of course, is that if the coins are struck but there is no demand, they will need to be stored somewhere at some cost to the government. I will introduce into the RECORD a letter to that effect from the Federal Reserve.

Mr. Castle and other supporters of this legislation have signaled their intent to revisit this provision in the upcoming session to try to find a way to stimulate demand for the Sakakawea design, and I pledge to work with them in that effort.

Part of the letter from the Federal Res......

The Senate-passed bill would exacerbate the Reserve Banks' inventory challenges, compared to the House-passed bill, by requiring the minting and issuance of Sacagawea $1 coins "in quantities no less than 1/3 of the total $1 coins minted and issued" under the Presidential $1 coin program. Establishing such a relative quota for Sacagawea coins, irrespective of the actual public demand for that specific coin design, would likely further increase the amount of excess coin held at the Reserve Banks. Federal Reserve Board staff estimates that the Sacagawea coin quota would further increase the cost associated with storing excess dollar coins by as much as one-third, or $15 million, to an estimated net present value of approximately $60 million over the life of the program.

Rep Castle, DE........

"I must say that I am concerned about what Senator Dorgan did put into the bill, because I prefer what we worked out in the House as a better solution to this, and that is an edition of the third of the coins now still to be Sakakawea, and I am afraid they are going to sit and collect dust and not be distributed.

At this point I would rather have done this differently. But we are working on that, and hopefully we will have a better solution to recognize the great American Indians and what they have done for us in this country before we are all said and done, even while this program is going on. I think there are perhaps better solutions than what the Senate actually did, but that is something we are not going to do unless we all agree. So I think we should pass this legislation, which is very good legislation; and if we can make it even better, we should come back and try to do that at some point in the future. We will continue to work on that."

< At this point I would rather have done this differently. But we are working on that, and hopefully we will have a better solution to recognize the great American Indians and what they have done for us in this country before we are all said and done, even while this program is going on. >

Why do I see the Great American Indian Dimes series coming?

Mr. Castle and other supporters of this legislation have signaled their intent to revisit this provision in the upcoming session to try to find a way to stimulate demand for the Sakakawea design, and I pledge to work with them in that effort. (From my post just above)

This is why we have the NATIVE AMERICAN $1 COIN PROGRAM legislation.

The mint lists dollar coin production figure for Jan. & Feb. at 356,000,000. It dosen't say if these are all President coins or if they have started minting Sackies.

I think Coinworld reported roughly 300 million Washington Dollars made

So that means they have to make 100 million Sackies

From the mint's site:

<pre>January 2007 through February 2007
1 ¢ 5 ¢ 10 ¢ 25 ¢ 50 ¢ 1 $ - GD Total:
Denver 570 M 129 M 219 M 258 M 2 M 176 M 1,354 M
Philadelphia 674 M 100 M 118 M 239 M 0 M 181 M 1,311 M
Total: 1,244 M 228 M 336 M 497 M 2 M 356 M 2,665 M
GD - Sacagawea / Golden Dollar</pre>

Its one out of 3...thats 150 million Sackies.

What's particularly fascinating about the dollar coin bruhaha is this:

Dollar coins have been a waste for more than 120 years.

The Morgan and Peace dollars were coined to satisfy silver states; it was essentially a large scale pork barrel project. There was little demand for them, although they did circulate in western states.

The Ike was (allegedly) designed to replace the once superfluous but now very dear Morgan and Peace dollars once the price of silver rose. However these pocket-busters weren't used except in slot machines.

The SBA had obvious problems, plus more were minted than were needed.

The Sac solved some problems, but could not compete with a dollar bill. Also, too many were minted once again.

I had some hope for the presidential coins; they were almost ugly enough to circulate. They're close to my dream of a "Pig's Backside Dollar" which would be so horrendous they would be spent and not hoarded.

However, the plain edge error killed that dream. Now they'll be hoarded like everything else. I'm aghast at how awful they are.

Fjord makes some excellent points. One thing as collectors we often forget was the purpose of silver dollars. We tend to romanticize about them circulating at face value, and although they certainly did, the vast majority were used as backing for the issuance of silver certificates! I read somewhere online, the account of the early peace dollar mintages that were so high because it was cheaper to mint the silver dollars to back the issuance of silver certificates than for the government to issue bonds at 2% interest to back the issuance of greenbacks. So although we may have fond notions of poker games in the old west for a pile of Morgans, the reality was that even then, the silver dollars were simply stored in the event that someone actually wanted the silver for their paper dollars.

All I know is Im having fun spending these Washington dollars. Gave 3 to the paper girl last night. Gotta get to the bank and reload.

Spent some at the Post Office this afternoon. The clerk says they like them but are out right now.

Spent some in Walgreens for milk. The clerk didn't blink and eye. Just counted out my change.

I see that this thread has been rekicked alive.

I think that it is a ratio of 3:1, so for every three Pres dollars One Sac will be minted. At least that is how I have interpreted the articles I have read.

Not 3 to 1. One third of the dollar coins minted must be sackies, so the ratio is actually 2 to 1.

SEC. 102. PRESIDENTIAL $1 COIN PROGRAM.


`(B.) CONTINUITY PROVISIONS-

`(i) IN GENERAL- Notwithstanding subparagraph (A), the Secretary shall continue to mint and issue $1 coins which bear any design in effect before the issuance of coins as required under this subsection (including the so-called `Sacagawea-design' $1 coins).

`(ii) CIRCULATION QUANTITY- Beginning January 1, 2007, and ending upon the termination of the program under paragraph (8), the Secretary annually shall mint and issue such `Sacagawea-design' $1 coins for circulation in quantities of no less than 1/3 of the total $1 coins minted and issued under this subsection.'.

So from that wording, the new reverse design SACs should count toward that number.

Ah yes... I do see after some quick google research that my math was in error, and Dockwalliper is correct. It is two pres coins, one sackie to be minted out. My fuzzy brain had it that I read in Coin World it was a three pres to one Sac ratio. Who knows, maybe at one time it was going to be, because I just read an early interview with the key sponsor of the bill, Rep. Michael Castle, R-Del. where it said the Sac would be discontinued. Reference Story

So yes, based on the initial mintage reports on just the Washington coin, there are going to be a glut of Sacagawea's in the vaults.

Preliminary total mintage for the Washington dollar coins.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

(D) 163,680,000

(P) 176,680,000

total 340,360,000

So thats 170,180,000 Sackies (So far) Already surpassing the combined Sackie mintage for the last 5 years. (By far)

The 400 million plus 2007 Sackies are on the way.

http://www.numismaster.com/ta/numis/Articl...;ArticleId=2710

Don Charters asked Moy if the Mint was deliberately not striking 2007 Sacagawea dollars for circulation in hopes they would be abolished. Moy replied that the full year's production run is scheduled for the autumn.

The 400 million plus 2007 Sackies are on the way.

http://www.numismaster.com/ta/numis/Articl...;ArticleId=2710

Don Charters asked Moy if the Mint was deliberately not striking 2007 Sacagawea dollars for circulation in hopes they would be abolished. Moy replied that the full year's production run is scheduled for the autumn.

The 400 million plus 2007 Sackies are on the way.

http://www.numismaster.com/ta/numis/Articl...;ArticleId=2710

Don Charters asked Moy if the Mint was deliberately not striking 2007 Sacagawea dollars for circulation in hopes they would be abolished. Moy replied that the full year's production run is scheduled for the autumn.

The 400 million plus 2007 Sackies are on the way.

http://www.numismaster.com/ta/numis/Articl...;ArticleId=2710

Don Charters asked Moy if the Mint was deliberately not striking 2007 Sacagawea dollars for circulation in hopes they would be abolished. Moy replied that the full year's production run is scheduled for the autumn.

The 400 million plus 2007 Sackies are on the way.

http://www.numismaster.com/ta/numis/Articl...;ArticleId=2710

Don Charters asked Moy if the Mint was deliberately not striking 2007 Sacagawea dollars for circulation in hopes they would be abolished. Moy replied that the full year's production run is scheduled for the autumn.

The 400 million plus 2007 Sackies are on the way.

http://www.numismaster.com/ta/numis/Articl...;ArticleId=2710

Don Charters asked Moy if the Mint was deliberately not striking 2007 Sacagawea dollars for circulation in hopes they would be abolished. Moy replied that the full year's production run is scheduled for the autumn.

3 x double post. Impressive!

That is a phenomenal amount of coins. Are they all minted at the same mint?

Wow, I was afraid we might have 400 million posts about the 400 million sackies!

What a mess. I use fast reply and this is what I get

Lol, I would like to see that happen.
But then we would overload the forum's server

They shoulds be evenly split between Philly and Denver. The proofs and mint set satins don't count towards the totals.

I had to go back and reread this thread, it was a good one.

Lokks like the mint got the reprive it was looking for. There will be no 400 million 2007 Sackies to kick around.
Congress did it with one line in the new "native American Dollar Coin Act".

SEC. 3. TECHNICAL AND CONFORMING AMENDMENTS.

Section 5112(n)(1) of title 31, United States Code, is amended--

(1) by striking the paragraph designation and heading and all that follows through `Notwithstanding subsection (d)' and inserting the following:

`(1) REDESIGN BEGINNING IN 2007- Notwithstanding subsection (d)';

(2) by striking subparagraph (B.); and

(3) by redesignating clauses (i) and (ii) as subparagraphs (A) and (B.), respectively, and indenting the subparagraphs appropriately.

That was the paragraph that called for one third of dollar coin production to be Sackies.

I wonder how the South Dakota Reps voted? It was a voice vote...I guess they got shouted down.

Better tell that to the edtors of coinage.

Bags of 2007 sackie dollars are no longer available from the mint.

I wonder if the news about no circulation sackies caused a rush.