elverno Posted August 3, 2006 Report Share Posted August 3, 2006 1808 La Reine de Naples, France Laskey CXL Bramsen 772 d'Essling 2543 22mm Link In 1808 and later in 1813 there were a series of medal mint visitation medals produced featuring Napoleon's sisters, wife and step-daughter. I've called the series "The Ladies". 1808 La Princesse Pauline, France Laskey CXXXIX Bramsen 770 d'Essling 2548 22mm Link 22mm Link 1808 La princesse Pauline visite la Monnaie des médailles, France Bramsen 771 d'Essling 1219 22mm Link Pauline was Napoleon's favorite sister though she drove him nuts with her crazy behavior. But she was loyal until the end, gave him her jewels and offered to join him in exile. If you examine the two examples closely they were clearly struck from two different dies. 1808 Hortense, Reine de Hollande, France Bramsen 767 d'Essling 2438 22mm Link Hortense was Napoleon's step-daughter and later his sister-in-law. Though British propaganda tried to make their relationship into an incestuous one there is no evidence that he ever regarded her as anything except his daughter. 1808 La Reine Hortense, France Bramsen 769 Laskey CXLI Edwards 394 d'Essling 1218 22mm Link 22mm Link On the occasion of the Queen's visit to the medal mint. 1808 La princesse Elisa visite la Monnaie des médailles, France Bramsen 776 Edwards 396 d'Essling 1221 23mm Link While she was a princess of France Napoleon only saw fit to give sister Elisa a Grand Duchy. She was furious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elverno Posted August 3, 2006 Author Report Share Posted August 3, 2006 1808 Hungarian Coronation Medal 21.5mm Link I really don't know much about this piece. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elverno Posted August 4, 2006 Author Report Share Posted August 4, 2006 1808 Loge des Arts réunis à Rouen, France Bramsen 832 Edwards 446 Marvin XCIII d'Essling 2293 31mm Link These are reimages of the masonic medals I put into a previous thread. 1808 Loge des Cœurs unis, France Bramsen 829 Edwards 443 Marvin CXLVII d'Essling 2127 27mm Link 1808 Loge d'Isis, France Bramsen 828 Edwards 442 d'Essling 2126 27mm (tin) Link 27mm (bronze) Link The engraver Merlen's work was often cast rather than struck and this medal is an example. The copper or bronze piece may be a cast copy considering the crudeness of the work compared to the tin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elverno Posted August 4, 2006 Author Report Share Posted August 4, 2006 1808 Avoués de Villefranche, France Bramsen 815 d'Essling 2375 32mm Link This is a lawyer's token. The women represent Justice and France respectively. The oddly beautiful toning I believe is the result of an old lacquer job. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scottishmoney Posted August 4, 2006 Report Share Posted August 4, 2006 Wasn't the Queen Caroline medal in a PCI? I recognise it. Thanks for sharing these, beautiful pieces all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elverno Posted August 4, 2006 Author Report Share Posted August 4, 2006 You have a good eye. Yes, the Caroline was in one of the PCI's and did pretty well. I'm re-photographing my entire collection. This has the dual purpose of keeping me from spending all of my money on coins and medals and improving my picture taking skills at the same time. Just the process is teaching me all the things I didn't know to ask... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elverno Posted August 4, 2006 Author Report Share Posted August 4, 2006 1808 Bataille de Sommo-Sierra, France Laskey XCVI Bramsen 756 d'Essling 1216 41mm Link This is a medal with two great stories attached to it. One is numismatic. This is a plain-edged medal. Normally, in terms of a First Empire medal, that means it is an original strike. However, this one was struck nearly thirty years later. The clue is in the engraving in the reverse. Bramsen, who was as expert as anyone on the subject of Napoleonic medals, has a note at the end of his description. But he was wrong. Here's how I put it on my site when my good friend David Block let me know I had a restrike: "Fortiter's research indicates: "Bramsen, following Fellmann in the Tresor claims that the JEU. signature is apocryphal, that the die was actually cut by Brenet. Bramsen either did not read or did not understand the entry in the French mint catalog of 1892, which explains that the die by Jeuffroy was first used in England after 1815, that Brenet copied the die for the French mint (adding his signature to that of Jeuffroy). Thus French strikes will bear both signatures and date from after 1830." Thus, my example is one that illustrates a medal struck in the 1830-1842 period. At this time the edges of copper and bronze medals were plain-edged. Only research of the type indicated can definitely identify such a medal as opposed to an original pre-1815 strike." The second story is on the subject of the medal itself. I quote myself: "Sommo Sierra was the site of some of the greatest bravery exhibited during the Napoleonic Wars. Napoleon was determined to capture Madrid and the Spanish Junta equally determined that he shouldn't get there without a fight. In his hurry to cross the Somosierra pass Napoleon neglected to properly assault the 16 cannon mentioned by Laskey and he began to get bogged down. Annoyed, he turned to Captain Korjietulski (or Kozietulski), commander of the Third Squadron of the Polish Light Horse, who were the current escort for the Emperor, and ordered them to take the position at the gallop. In a near suicidal charge, lasting only seven minutes, nearly 70% of the squadron became casualties. Actually, different authorities have different numbers involved and casualties suffered. One says 60 of 88 who charged (approx. 70%) while another says 82 of 150 (55%). Napoleon leaned over the bleeding body of Lt. Niegolewski who had captured a battery of guns with his troop and, removing his own cross of the Legion of Honor, pinned it on him. Forty-seven years later the Lieutenant would write, "would that many a youth might live to see such a day!" A second charge by two remaining squadrons was executed as part of a correctly coordinated attack on the position. With minimal losses the cannon were all captured. Napoleon typically failed to mention the first charge in his bulletin of December 2nd, 1808 but there is evidence that he never forgot the Poles' bravery and sacrifice. Napoleon later would award sixteen crosses of the Legion of Honor, ending the ceremony by taking off his hat and crying, "You are worthy to belong to my Old Guard. Honor to the bravest of the brave!"" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scottishmoney Posted August 5, 2006 Report Share Posted August 5, 2006 Even with the Napoleon Medal, one can draw very appreciable parallels with ancient themes, and the depictions of the subject. Obviously that they were influenced by ancient coins Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elverno Posted August 5, 2006 Author Report Share Posted August 5, 2006 Even with the Napoleon Medal, one can draw very appreciable parallels with ancient themes, and the depictions of the subject. Obviously that they were influenced by ancient coins Yes, the engravers were classically trained and at least at the Paris mint had a huge coin cabinet of ancient coins to draw inspiration from. At the beginning of the French Revolution there was a fad that glorified Greek culture and particularly the era of the Roman Republic. Women wore almost see-through clothing in a style that was declared Greek though it almost certainly was because several of the leading ladies were apparently equipped to carry off the style... Men wore togas and had haircuts in the "Brutus" style. This took place up to and through the Terror. It must have been a weird and silly time. The fashions changed to the "Egyptian" style after Napoleon returned from that expedition and the effects of all those fads carried on for decades in medals, coins, furniture, clothing, theater, music, you name it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scottishmoney Posted August 5, 2006 Report Share Posted August 5, 2006 Yes, the engravers were classically trained and at least at the Paris mint had a huge coin cabinet of ancient coins to draw inspiration from. At the beginning of the French Revolution there was a fad that glorified Greek culture and particularly the era of the Roman Republic. Women wore almost see-through clothing in a style that was declared Greek though it almost certainly was because several of the leading ladies were apparently equipped to carry off the style... The cabinet in the Monnaie de Paris museum is well worth a very long visit. The first time I went I spent literally hours in there. The second time I was rushed through by my wife, with some litany about spending too much money, time etc there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill Posted August 5, 2006 Report Share Posted August 5, 2006 1808 La Reine de Naples, FranceLaskey CXL Bramsen 772 d'Essling 2543 22mm Link In 1808 and later in 1813 there were a series of medal mint visitation medals produced featuring Napoleon's sisters, wife and step-daughter. I've called the series "The Ladies". Your collection is truly exceptional, but there are pieces that stand out for each of us because of personal likes, dislikes, etc. I love the style and themes of this particular medal. You have been very careful to note originals and restrikes. I am struck by the beautiful preservation state of this medal. I know your pieces are of high quality and your photography is exceptional, but even so, I get the feeling that this must be a stunning piece that must be even better in person. I'm not sure how to phrase my question. Can you comment on the quality of this particular medal. Is it unusual for the series, the type, your collection, etc? Does it look good in the photograph but is in fact not exceptional? Do you know much of its history and how it survived in its current state? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elverno Posted August 5, 2006 Author Report Share Posted August 5, 2006 Your collection is truly exceptional, but there are pieces that stand out for each of us because of personal likes, dislikes, etc. I love the style and themes of this particular medal. You have been very careful to note originals and restrikes. I am struck by the beautiful preservation state of this medal. I know your pieces are of high quality and your photography is exceptional, but even so, I get the feeling that this must be a stunning piece that must be even better in person. I'm not sure how to phrase my question. Can you comment on the quality of this particular medal. Is it unusual for the series, the type, your collection, etc? Does it look good in the photograph but is in fact not exceptional? Do you know much of its history and how it survived in its current state? The Caroline is in particularly nice condition. Most French medals of this era have a certain amount of oxidation, usually on the highest points, even in the nicest of condition. When you have the Caroline in hand, and it's less than an inch across, you are left wondering how the engravers of the time with their relatively primitive equipment could produce such masterpieces. The photograph doesn't do this medal justice. There's a subtle toning that I can't seem to capture. I've tried the angled glass technique but then I find I lose the actual color of the field. With the current technique I'm using I get the color but lose the toning, the pics seem a bit flat for lack of a better word. I'm seriously considering sending a few of my more common examples to the NGC conservation group to see if they can handle removing the oxidation. I store the medals in oversized non-PVC flips but I suspect that previous owners didn't treat them as nicely. Like most of us I consider my collection a trust I hold for the future and feel that if it's possible to pass on to future collectors in the same shape as I received them that I'll have done my job. But there's so much PVC and other damage that they've been subject to that I'm hoping to pass on in better condition, or at least so that they won't deteriorate from where they are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elverno Posted August 5, 2006 Author Report Share Posted August 5, 2006 1808 The Battles of Rolica and Vimiero, Great Britain BHM 636 15mm Link This was part of a series of tiny medals released in a brass tube in 1815. It's certainly possible that the place names of the two battles have changed over the years but it's interesting that both have changed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill Posted August 5, 2006 Report Share Posted August 5, 2006 When you have the Caroline in hand, and it's less than an inch across, you are left wondering how the engravers of the time with their relatively primitive equipment could produce such masterpieces. The photograph doesn't do this medal justice. There's a subtle toning that I can't seem to capture. I've tried the angled glass technique but then I find I lose the actual color of the field. With the current technique I'm using I get the color but lose the toning, the pics seem a bit flat for lack of a better word. I suspected something like that from the photograph. It gives me that sense that its spectacular and the picture doesn't quite catch it. I've taken to snapping two images, one with the axial ligthing through the angled glass, then a send with direct light, but leaving the glass in place so there is no movement. I then process each image in Photoshop to try to capture the best elements of that partuclar lighting technique. Finally, I overlay one with the other (generally the darker image as the base) and tinker with the opacity of the top image to get the best possible image. Sometimes it works. I have no qualm about toying with hue, saturation, etc to try to get the characteristics to emerge that I want to capture. Sometimes its easy. Other pieces just seem bound and determined to withhold their beauty from a mere mortal photographer such as myself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elverno Posted August 6, 2006 Author Report Share Posted August 6, 2006 1808 Réunion de l'Etrurie a l'Empire, France Laskey XCII Brasmen 721 d'Essling 1205 41mm Link A medal that has been so harshly cleaned that at first I thought that it was a cast copy. But I'm fairly certain it is an original. But if there is a heaven for coins and medals that have been victims of coinslaughter this is one that should be there. Until then I'm giving it a home. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elverno Posted August 6, 2006 Author Report Share Posted August 6, 2006 1808 L'Entrée a Madrid, France Laskey XCVII Bramsen 757 d'Essling 1217 40mm Link A horribly damaged medal. It commemorated Napoleon's entry into Madrid. When things started out badly for his army without him and the British took Madrid Napoleon gathered up his Guard and showed up in person. He scattered Spanish armies and forced the British army into a disasterous retreat. But politics at home caught up with him and he left the destruction of the British army to subordinates, a task they weren't up to. Napoleon never returned to Spain and the ulcer ultimately led to his downfall. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AuldFartte Posted August 7, 2006 Report Share Posted August 7, 2006 Another WOW !!! My favorites are the 1808 Bataille de Sommo-Sierra and the 1808 La Princesse Pauline with the "Three Graces" reverse. Awesome pieces. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
applenyc Posted August 24, 2016 Report Share Posted August 24, 2016 I recently bought an interesting bracelet. Here is the only place I can find the background information about the motif! Thank you very much! could you please take a look at my photos, my question is ,are they real coins or the reproduced(cast) ones? where are these coins been made? whats the little mark on the back of the coin? thanks a lot! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
applenyc Posted August 24, 2016 Report Share Posted August 24, 2016 more photos Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thedeadpoint Posted August 30, 2016 Report Share Posted August 30, 2016 Maybe constanius can help you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bagerap Posted August 30, 2016 Report Share Posted August 30, 2016 I can't help you with the initials on the clasp, but the small mark on the reverse looks like a cornucopia, or in French corne d'abondance. It is the mark of the Paris Mint (Monnaie de Paris) and in this context could date your bracelet between 1880-1901. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
applenyc Posted September 4, 2016 Report Share Posted September 4, 2016 Who? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
applenyc Posted September 4, 2016 Report Share Posted September 4, 2016 Omg thank you so much! Yes, that's a little shape with a number 1. The text on the clasp I already find out, it means French products without government issue.what do you think this coins for? It only have one side... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bagerap Posted September 5, 2016 Report Share Posted September 5, 2016 It was made as jewelry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
applenyc Posted September 5, 2016 Report Share Posted September 5, 2016 That makes perfect sense! I also have a very old French coin bracelet contains eight 20 real silver centimes from 1809-1887? Most of them have the second emperor's head. Two from 1863. I wonder if convert the coin to jewelery will defect the coin value?( no holes on it) sorry I got so many questions, I'm very new to the coins world as you can tell, it's so fascinating! I admired your knowledge so much! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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